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 Author | Topic: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province (Read 10,673 times) |
raymond
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|  | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #15 on Mar 28, 2007, 7:52pm » | |
Cheryl,
Sorry for the confusion in terminology regarding the Shiqi River. In order to garner an overall appreciation of this topic, one should understand that the Pearl River Delta in Guangdong Province is part of an estuary, which in technical terms, an estuary is a semi-enclosed coastal body of water with one or more rivers or streams flowing into it, and with a free connection to the open sea (from wikipedia.com). The Pearl River estuary receives water from the West, North and East Rivers, and there are more than 200 waterways in the delta area. The water in these waterways flows in different directions, thus forming a highly complex river network. These waterways ultimately empty into the South China Sea. As twoupman has so aptly pointed out, the Shiqi River is one of these waterways that flow through Shekki (now called Zhongshan City), and it is not part of the Pearl River that runs through Guangzhou. While the Shiqi River is not technically a tributary to the Pearl River itself, it is an integral part of what is called the Pearl River waterway system. Thus, the Shiqi River is a separate waterway.
This explanation is a bit technical, but I hope this clarifies the genesis of the Shiqi River for you. Take a look at a map of the Pearl River Delta for additional clarity.
Raymond
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Henry
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #16 on Mar 28, 2007, 8:40pm » | |
Dear Colleagues,
I thought you may find the following historical maps of the Pearl River Delta - interesting. They appeared in the article " People Said Extinction Was Not Possible;" 2000 Years of Environmental Change in South China by Professor Robert B. Marks.
I believe "Xiangshan" was a former name for Zhongshan.
Enjoy !
Henry
![[image]](http://mysite.verizon.net/vzepzaui/Delta - Historical.jpg "[image]")
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cheryl
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #17 on Mar 29, 2007, 12:15am » | |
Dear Raymond,
Thanks. I'll give it a try now that I have the current names.
Cheryl
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cheryl
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #18 on Mar 29, 2007, 12:18am » | |
Oops, my last reply should have been to twoupman for an earlier reply. Sorry for the confusion.
Thanks. I'll give it a try now that I have the current names.
Cheryl
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cheryl
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #19 on Mar 29, 2007, 12:24am » | |
Dear Raymond and Henry,
Thanks for the information about the Pearl River system and the maps. I am learning quite a bit about the area and how the rivers flow to the surrounding villages. Henry, am I correct in assuming that the bottom right map is the most current?
Cheryl
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Henry
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #20 on Mar 29, 2007, 8:36am » | |
Hi Cheryl,
Yes, the bottom right map was the latest of the 4 maps. The "CE" acronym/abbreviation may be confusing - so, I found a short explanation from the Internet:
"CE stands for "Common Era." It is a relatively new term that is experiencing increased usage and is expected to eventually replace AD. The latter is an abbreviation for "Anno Domini" in Latin or "the year of the Lord" in English. The latter refers to the approximate birth year of Yeshua of Nazareth (a.k.a. Jesus Christ). CE and AD have the same and value. 2004 CE = 2004 AD.
BCE stands for "Before the common era." It is expected to eventually replace BC, which means "Before Christ," or "Before the Messiah." BC and BCE are also identical in value."
These historical maps are interesting because they portray the development and growth of the Pearl River Delta over time - which in part explains why many of the cities and towns in the Pearl River Delta might only appear on current maps and not on historical maps.
Henry
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Henry
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #21 on Apr 10, 2007, 5:03pm » | |
Hi Cheryl,
I think I have found your ancestral village "An Hang". Please look in the NW quadrant of the map and you'll see the arrow pointing to the village just beneath the road marker " G105" This is an August 2005 map and I believe it is the latest map commercially available.
Can one of our Chinese literate colleagues confirm the Chinese characters for "An Hang". I know the first character, but, I do not know the second character and also, I believe it is in simplified Chinese.
Henry
PS - I have removed the map since the village that I identified is not your ancestral village An Hang.
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twoupman
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #22 on Apr 10, 2007, 9:38pm » | |
Henry,
It is not An Hang (what dialect?) but Anle (安樂 in Traditional characters) which means peace and happiness.
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Henry
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #23 on Apr 10, 2007, 10:01pm » | |
Cheryl,
Sorry - please see if you can provide the Chinese characters for An Hang. Thanks Al.
Henry
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tyuti1668
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #24 on Jul 22, 2007, 5:04pm » | |
Asked some old fellowes:
"Ah Hang" in dialect = Today's "下澤"
![[image]](http://lh4.ggpht.com/_4jPdsOKOeuA/TD6HEw3mZ0I/AAAAAAAAABw/9t7i6BDtX2M/s700/Image1.jpg "[image]")
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mugenpower168
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #25 on Jul 13, 2010, 3:16am » | |
Jul 12, 2010, 6:02pm, tyuti1668 wrote:
Jul 12, 2010, 10:09am, mugenpower168 wrote:
Which other villages east of the river speak Longdu dialect? |
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the "outlying" Longdu speaking area:
南区 : 月山 寮后 金溪 沙田 树涌
坦背 : 观栏
板芙 : around 里溪/深湾
神灣 : 芒冲
Similar dialect also in 唐家 淇澳岛 |
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Hi tyuti1668,
This post was originally posted in Douglas' "My Excellent Adventures in China" thread but I do not want to add irrelevant posts to it so I thought it would be more appropriate to post here. I want to ask if 月山, 金溪, 樹涌, 觀欄, 里溪 and 芒沖 had former names because I can't seem to find these villages in this database. http://www.c-c-c.org/villagedb/search.cgi
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tyuti1668
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mugenpower168
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #27 on Jul 13, 2010, 8:58pm » | |
Thanks for the links, they are very informative.
I would like to know exactly where the historic district of Longdu encompasses. Nearly all articles I have read say that it is the present day Dachong and Shaxi. However, from this article http://www.zs.gov.cn/main/about/infoview/index.action?id=41789 it says that 隆鎮/第二區 covers the present day "沙溪、大涌、橫欄、沙朗和板莢(I think this is supposed to be 板芙)西部一帶," thus indicating that Longdu covered an area beyond just Dachong and Shaxi.
My questions are:
1. Which villages of 橫欄 and 板芙 are part of the historic district of Longdu?
2. Are there any other areas that were once part of Longdu that the article neglects to mention?
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tyuti1668
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #28 on Jul 13, 2010, 10:07pm » | |
Those non- 沙溪、大涌 area are alluvial field (沙田). The resdientis are Yue speaker (南番順 immgrant) that rents land. In past we called them "蜑家佬". When communist tooks power, they ruined Longdu speaker's benefit.
--
Zhongshan Outlaws in ROC (http://www.zsnews.cn/ZT/ZSZX/showindex_1188.shtml) had many stories releated to thoese "profitable" area .
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mugenpower168
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| | Re: Lung Doo area in Guangdong Province
« Reply #29 on Jul 13, 2010, 10:58pm » | |
I see, so although there were areas outside Dachong/Shaxi that were administratively part of Longdu, only Dachong/Shaxi (and to an extent some of the outlying villages previously mentioned) are culturally/linguistically considered Longdu. Is this correct?
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