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Post by philiptancl on Aug 4, 2019 2:10:55 GMT -5
Hi Lihui,
In China, traditionally, ALL the truly relevant traces and information about a person’s family history are maintained within the wider family (i.e. the clan). This means that the key sources are mostly kept inside a person’s ancestral village in China. The village, where your great grandfather originated from, may still have village genealogy books that record your ancestor’s lineage.
If your great grandfather, his two brothers or their wives had passed on, do get photos of their gravestones in Isabela, Philippines and wherever their final resting places. Their names in Chinese characters (and their children) may be written there and likely the name of their ancestral place.
Also do search out any written papers or written records that your great grandfather had left behind for his descendants.
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Post by lihui on Aug 4, 2019 3:14:39 GMT -5
Hello Mr. Tan! Thank you for your response. I can't find out any written papers or written records that my great grandfather had left behind for his descendants but I will try to get photos of my grandfathers' gravestones here in Isabela and send it to you so that you can help me in finding my ancestral village in China. Thank you so much!
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Post by limkhangwei on Aug 7, 2019 6:08:12 GMT -5
My mane 林 康 伟. I want to know abuat my grand grandfather He name is 林 鸿 雁 。he is from 奎 山. He come to Malaysia in 1900 ++.
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Post by philiptancl on Aug 8, 2019 8:17:03 GMT -5
Ho Limkhangwei Is what is shown below the 奎山 in Fujian where your ancestor 林鸿雁 originated from? If that is so, you need to make a trip there to find out what you are after.
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Post by debbielim on Sept 12, 2019 4:37:09 GMT -5
Dear Philip Tan,
I would like to seek your kind advice about my Lim Clan. I was told by my grandparents that my Great Great Grandpa was from China, he came to Malaysia Penang back in 1870s (I believe) as my Great Grandpa was born in Malaysia in the year of 1881. However, I am not sure if I could track back our Lim Clan history from you. I have limited info about it, I was told by my Aunty that our Lim Clan was from 福建,漳州海澄. Do you have any history record of Lim Clan from this town?
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Post by philiptancl on Sept 13, 2019 6:06:28 GMT -5
Hi Debbielim, From what I understand Haicheng (海澄) now has 5 residential communities and 19 villages under its administration. Knowing that your ancestry is from there would be a good start. The next thing you should get the names of your ancestors (in Chinese characters) starting from your Great Great Grandpa down. Locate their graves and that of their spouses as that would be one and good source of getting their names in Chinese characters as well as other details. It would also confirm whether your ancestry originates from Haicheng (海澄) and hopefully could also provide the specific village as well. Hopefully you could also determine the generation levels they are in so as to make the search easier. I do not have any ancestral records (zupu) from Haicheng (海澄) area. Even if I have, you still need those name(s) in Chinese characters to trace your ancestry. For me to ask my Lim contacts for help (through various Lim WeChat groups they are in) the minimum they need would be the name(s) of your ancestor(s) in Chinese characters before they could check through any Lim clans zupu from Haicheng (海澄). There is also a possibility that other of your relatives descended from your Great Great Grandpa or related to him already has a copy of the zupu/jiapu or some other documents relating to your ancestry. Do ask around.
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Post by debbielim on Sept 14, 2019 9:28:45 GMT -5
Hi Philip Tan, Below attached my great grandpa & grandpa details however I had asked around my aunt & parents, it seems that no one knows where is my Great Great Grandpa Tombs (except my great grandpa) & my late grandpa also did not mentioned much as they are more English educated. Myself too has limited info about my Lim family tree. Looking at my late Great Grandpa info, it seems the Lim Clan from Xia Men? Pls take a look of the picture attached. Not sure will this help you to ask around the Lim Clan contacts? Looking forward to hear from you soon.
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Post by philiptancl on Sept 14, 2019 19:41:33 GMT -5
Hi Debbielim,
These are good information you are providing where the dates of birth and death both according to Gregorian (陽曆) and Chinese Lunar (農曆) calendars are provided as well. The place of ancestral place quoted is only given as Fujian (福建), Xiamen (廈門) but did not do down further to Haicheng (海澄) town or the specific ancestral village there where they originated from. Just as well that your Aunty quoted Haicheng (海澄); otherwise it would make you search quite futile.
I shall forward your information to my Lim first cousin-once-removed for him to ask around from his Fujian Lim Wechat groups to assist in locating your ancestral records. Should that be not fruitful, you may wish to consider engaging someone to go to the field to do the search for you. Are you still in Malaysia?
Philip
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Post by debbielim on Sept 15, 2019 4:38:53 GMT -5
Hi Philip, Thanks for the help & looking forward to hear from you. My grandpa did not keep track on any info about our Lim Clan. Until my generation it eventually lost track. When we were young we too don’t know how to ask & yes. I am from Malaysia, currently station in Penang Island ...
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Post by debbielim on Sept 15, 2019 6:09:57 GMT -5
Hi Philip,
Latest info I get from my Aunt. My great great grandpa initially from Bagan Serai, Perak. I will try to check with friends who stay nearby that area to check which Chinese Cemetery is the oldest back then... I hope 🤞🏽 to seek more info however it would be finding a needle in a haystack 😰... during WW2, they moved & hide. I hope the universe would help me dig more info piece by piece ... 🙏🙏
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Post by philiptancl on Sept 17, 2019 4:18:40 GMT -5
Hi Debbie,
I am from Kuala Lumpur. Just sent you a personal message through this Forum giving my hand-phone contact. You can contact me through WhatsApp or Wechat through it if it is more expedient. I have passed the information provided by you to my first-cousin-once-removed (Stephen Lim) to assist.
Genealogical Society Singapore recently sounded me out to give a talk in Singapore around the week-end of Dec 14/15 2019 to give talk on “CHINESE GENEALOGY: Trace your Ancestry and Chart your Family Tree” and workshops. The society is currently arranging the events. I suppose it could too far for you to attend. I gave the talk in Malacca just on July 2019.
Philip
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will
Member
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Post by will on Nov 10, 2019 7:54:36 GMT -5
Hi, my search for the very first Lim in Gulou, Shantou, has led me to this forum. I'm amazed at what comes up and I don't doubt the amount of time and effort that has been put in by the more learned here. Guess I am trying to trace my line from the first Lim in Gulou, Shantou back to Bi Gan somehow. For my efforts so far, I've come up with a lot of hearsay and possibly myths with conflicting information at times. All I know for a fact so far is, that this Lim arrived in Gulou, Shantou sometime over 800 years ago. There is a stone tablet erected in 1990 at the start of Gulou Road and this road leads to a rather extensive residence which is supposedly a Lim ancestral home in Shantou for my lineage. I have not been to this residence at all unfortunately and only some photos of it and looks to be in an old sad state of disrepair; probably soon it will be just another missing historical footnote for my future generations. To start, any advice or help on finding or how to find who this Lim was would be greatly appreciated. I've added a picture of the tablet, hopefully I've done this correctly and its readable.
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Post by philiptancl on Nov 12, 2019 2:18:41 GMT -5
Hi Will,
As I understand it, Lin Lu (林祿) had arrived in Fujian (福建) in 326 AD during the Eastern Jin Dynasty (東晉朝). Lin Lu is the Founder of the southern branch of the Lims which comprises the various dialect groups found in Fujian, Hainan and Guangdong. His grave is situated on a mound called Ju Long Gang in the district of Hui-Ann in Fujian (I had visited the grave and the temple beside it some years ago). Eighteen generations from Lin Lu, during the Tang Dynasty (8th century AD), nine brothers of a single family all became governors (Jiu Mu 九牧). Their descendants all identified themselves as members of The Family of Nine Governors (Jiu Mu Pai 九牧派). Most Lim clans from Hainan and Shantou would belong to this branch and those who descended from Jiu Mu Pai(九牧派) would now be about some 40 plus generations counting from them. If the first Lim that arrived in Gulou, Shantou is sometime just over 800 years ago, that would be around some 25 generations back and would very likely be a descendant of this branch. If your ancestral record could be traced the ancestry to one of the nine governors, then I would think the ancestry to the first ancestor in Fujian, Lin Lu (林祿), would be accurate enough. However from Lin Lu up to Bi Gan, I have come across differences among some versions. From what I understand, for some version, the brothers of some generation were taken as descendants.
Philip
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will
Member
Posts: 4
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Post by will on Nov 12, 2019 6:29:11 GMT -5
Hello there Philip, Thank you very much for your reply. I just received some scans from a relative who had visited the place in Gulou. She was given some copied paperwork with some information but not being of Chinese education I am unable to understand its contents. I've attached a part of the scan which we believe to indicate the first Lim in Gulou but simply cannot figure out what his name is. There is a 'foreword' with it as well, perhaps you can make some sense of it. We think it says that the first Lim in Gulou is 28th generation, possibly after Bi Gan. As for the history of the current residence which I am also researching, there's a long passed tale/myth that the current residence was 'gifted' to the 10th generation Lim (starting from Gulou), by a Ming Emperor HC(??) in gratitude for healing his mother. So far I have not found anything other than hearsay to corroborate the tale. He was supposedly a court official and as well a Registrar(?) for Examinations and had some knowledge of medicine. Anyhow, I'm slowly trying to re-build this place in CG for the benefit of subsequent generations. Philip, you are from KL? I have some relations living in Malaysia in Klang and KL. My better half is from PJ, lol. We plan to make a trip to Gulou next year and will be in KL for some time just before that. Myself I'll be doing some research work in Malaysia as well. Thanks again for your response. Will
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Post by philiptancl on Nov 12, 2019 19:56:52 GMT -5
Hi Will, You are the 4th person this year that I am in contact with who are looking for Lim ancestries; the ancestry for other the three Lims are from Fujian. Yes I am living Kuala Lumpur while my wife hometown is from Klang. Maybe we could meet up in KL and it will be best before you go to Gulou. From what I could conjecture based on the paperwork you posted, they must have been copied from your clan ancestral records (zupu/jiapu). The zupu/jiapu might not been updated as yet. If that it so, you should copied (either scan or photocopy or use your hand phone) the complete ancestral records to bring back. If what you said about the 10th generator Lim, it should be recorded therein. Then you can start drawing up you lineage and hopefully to go all the way to Bi Gan and then to Huang Di. If you had read my other postings in this Forum, you would know I am illiterate in Chinese as well; not able to read and write in Chinese. That does not prevent me in trying to do and understand Chinese genealogy. Nevertheless, I have been invited by Genealogy Society Singapore to give a talk and conduct two workshops in Singapore on December 14 and 15, 2019. The flyers are shown below: The talk: The workshops: Philip Tan
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