Chen/Tan/Chan/Chin/Tran (陳/陈) Clan

[gggrandfather0085]

Hello,
There are over 100 million people with the surname Chen (and its various forms in different languages) around the world. According to the statistics by the Chinese DNA testing company 23mofang, their Y haplogroups and subclades are:


Surname Chen [ 陈 ] In China


O1a1a—F492(含F656)：7.7%
O2a2b1a1—M133*：3.9%
O2a2b1a2—F242(含CTS4266、F2137)：3.6%
O1b1a1—F923(含F1399、SK1627)：3.0%
O1a1a—F78(不含F492)：3.0%
O1b1a2 —F1759(含CTS1127) ：3.0%
O2a1c1a—F11*：2.5%
O2a2b1a1—CTS6987：2.5%
O2a2b1a1—F317：2.2%
O2a1a—L599 : 1.9%
O1b1a1—F4229 ：1.7%
C2c1—F845：1.4%
O1a1a—K644 : 1.4%
O2a2b1a1—CTS9678:1.4%
O2a2b1a1—F155(含F813、Y20928)： 1.4%
O2a2b2 —AM01822*：1.4%
O1b1a1—FGC19713：1.1%
O1a1b—CTS5726: 1.1%
O1b1a1—F838*: 1.1%
O1b1a1—F1199: 1.1%
O2a1c—F856：1.1%
O2a1c—F12：1.1%
O2a1c1b —F134*：1.1%
O2a2b1a2—A9472：1.1%
O2a2b1a1—SK1730：1.1%
O2a2b1a1—CTS4960：1.1%
O2a2b2 —F717:1.1%
Q1a1a1a—F1626：1.1%
N1a1a3—F4063: 1.1%
N1b1b—CTS962*: 1.1%
N1a2 —CTS2959(含F1998)：1.1%
N1b2— M1819 ：1.1%
O1a1a—M307.1*：1.1%
O2a2a1—M159：1.1%
O2a2b1a—A9457: 1.1%



Many of the Chens with the genealogy records of famous historical figures. For example, the YingChuan穎川 Chens have these people on the list:

陳蕃 (89 -168) 東漢尚書令

陳實 (104－187)，字仲弓，東漢潁川許昌人，潁川郡陳氏開基祖
陳群 (？－237) 字長文，潁川許昌人，東漢末年及三國時期曹魏大臣

陳霸先 陳朝高祖武皇帝

陳叔寶 陳朝陳後主


If you are one of the YingChuan Chens 穎川陳氏, do you also have these people on your genealogy record? 
What is your Y DNA?

[twnxn]

Yes, I saw that distribution from 23mofang. That shows people surnamed Chen have various backgrounds and that they are not all descendant from the same individual.

See my response in your "Guangdong Shunde Chen's genealogy" thread.

Per my family genealogy we are also part of the Yingchuan Chen. There are many sub-branches. My YDNA is O2a2a1a1a (O-M159). For some reason, 23mofang shows it as O2a2a1.

[gggrandfather0085]

I am intrigued to know why the populations of the Chen Clan on the southeast coast outnumber the other region in the north. It is said that Ying Chuan Hall takes nearly half of the total populations of the Chen Clan. 1.1% of O－M159 seems far too low. I wonder which is the haplogroup of the majority of Ying Chuan Chens. My subclade only has 1.1%. I believe that my family tree may not be directly related to Chen Shi 陳寔, Chen Baxian 陳霸先 and so on.
By the way, any DNA tests have been taken from the tombs of the Chen Dynasty so far? What's the DNA of the proven descendants of the royal family of the Chen Dynasty?

[mitrophan]

The surname 陳 (진/Jin) is also distributed in Korea. There are a few scanned zupu available at www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QS7-89QF-9SW4?owc=QDYT-3MC%3A1589986071%2C1589982393%3Fcc%3D1398522&cc=1398522

Can someone review those scans and identify when ethnic Koreans with same surname split off from the ethnic Chinese Chen tree?

[gggrandfather0085]

Here's some update of research. The Y-DNA of Chen Dynasty (陳霸先，陳叔寶,etc).

Royal Family of Chen Dynasty: Y-SNP: O1a1a-F492+F656-

23mofang reports 7.7% of the total Chens' samples.

Source: 
ranhaer.com/thread-35828-1-1.html

Therefore, my family tree is irrelevant to Chen Dynasty. All record before Chen Dynasty is fake.

[twnxn]

Interesting post. I thought most who claim to be part of the Yingchuan Chen Clan claim to be descendant of Chen Shi (陳寔) who lived between 104AD and 187AD during the Han Dynasty. The Chen Dynasty was much later spanning from 557AD to 589AD. Do members of the Chen Dynasty claim to be descendant of Chen Shi (陳寔)? The first emperor was Chen Baxian (陳霸先). What I can gather from these results is that members of the Chen Dynasty (557AD to 589AD) and their confirmed descendants are largely O1a1a-F492+F656. But, I always wonder if is possible to find out the YDNA of those who claim to be direct descendants of Chen Shi (陳寔). Going that back far will be more difficult. But, I did notice from the 23mofang report showing the distribution of the Chen surname- the highest percentages were O1a1a—F492(含F656)：7.7%
O2a2b1a1—M133*：3.9%
O2a2b1a2—F242(含CTS4266、F2137)：3.6%
O1b1a1—F923(含F1399、SK1627)：3.0%
O1a1a—F78(不含F492)：3.0%
O1b1a2 —F1759(含CTS1127) ：3.0%
O2a1c1a—F11*：2.5%
O2a2b1a1—CTS6987：2.5%
O2a2b1a1—F317：2.2%
O2a1a—L599 : 1.9%
O1b1a1—F4229 ：1.7%
C2c1—F845：1.4%
O1a1a—K644 : 1.4%
O2a2b1a1—CTS9678:1.4%
O2a2b1a1—F155(含F813、Y20928)： 1.4%
O2a2b2 —AM01822*：1.4%

Everything beyond that the YDNA appeared were just at 1.1%. I do agree that most people who claim to be part of the Yingchuan Chen clan are not direct descendants of Chen Shi (陳寔). Most are descendants of people who adopted the Chen surname.

During the Northern and Southern Dynasties period (420-589), Chen Baxian established the Chen Dynasty (557-589), the fourth and the last of the Southern dynasties, which was eventually destroyed by the Sui Dynasty. It was also during this period that nomadically-cultured Xianbei people had systematically assimilated into China's agrarian culture, and adopted Chinese surnames under the state directives of Emperor Xiaowen of Northern Wei; the Xianbei subjects whose surname of "侯莫陳" (Hóumòchén) were converted to "陳" (Chen).

[kc]

I'm YingChuan Chen. Ancestors came from Fujian Gutian (Fuzhou area). I'm tested O-FGC19713. Am I a real Chen??

[merantau]

By ISOGG 2019/20 tree (Tree keeps evolving so these haplogroup names change too.  I prefer to use terminal SNP labels),

O-FGC19713 is O1b1a1a1a1b1a1.  (equivalent to O-Y13994 in Yfull tree)

With the current ISOGG tree, the O1bs in the 23mofang table are:-

O1b1a1a1a1b1a1    FGC19713
O1b1a1a1a1a1a1a1 F923

O1b1a1b1a1a1 F1199
O1b1a2a1 F1759

O1b1a1a1a1b2a F4229

O1b1a1b F838

Your haplogroup is not a subclade of any of those O1b clades listed here so you could not be their patrilineal descendant.  You will also not be a patrilineal descendant of the others in that table.  But are the others "real" (however you want to define it) either?

[kc]

Jan 21, 2020 21:17:28 GMT -5 merantau said:

By ISOGG 2019/20 tree (Tree keeps evolving so these haplogroup names change too.  I prefer to use terminal SNP labels),

O-FGC19713 is O1b1a1a1a1b1a1.  (equivalent to O-Y13994 in Yfull tree)

With the current ISOGG tree, the O1bs in the 23mofang table are:-

O1b1a1a1a1b1a1    FGC19713
O1b1a1a1a1a1a1a1 F923

O1b1a1b1a1a1 F1199
O1b1a2a1 F1759

O1b1a1a1a1b2a F4229

O1b1a1b F838

Your haplogroup is not a subclade of any of those O1b clades listed here so you could not be their patrilineal descendant.  You will also not be a patrilineal descendant of the others in that table.  But are the others "real" (however you want to define it) either?

[kc]

Thank you Merantau. Not sure what to say but my family has been worshiping yingchuan Chen based on zupu book from ancestral village in Fijian. It was possible that my ancestors were native ancient baiyue that assimilated into Chen clan due to Han expansion

[twnxn]

Here is an update since my last post. I've since taken FTDNA Big Y700 and then uploaded my data to YFull. On YFull I am O-MF2541 though my SNPs also include O-MF2545 which is further downstream. In the FTDNA YDNA O Project, they assign me to O-MF2545 (see: www.familytreedna.com/public/o3?iframe=yresults) . Both YDNA O-MF2541 and YDNAO-MF2545 is further downstream from O-M159. My surname is also Chen- my father's family before settling Taiwan 220 or so years ago came from Zhangzhou, Fujian. China. The Chinese DNA company 23mofang did a study on surnames and YDNA and found YDNA O-MF2545 to be common in Guangdong, Fujian, Jiangxi and other regions, with Huang and Zeng as common surnames associated with it. See: www.23mofang.com/new/report/ancestry/family/5d3972a92cca730001ec56ca (if you can't read Chinese ,you can use Google Chrome as a browser when opening this link and have it translated into English). So, I am not sure if I am a truly part of the Yingchuan Chen Clan, though my genealogy says we are. My specific ancestral village within Zhangzhou, Fujian is largely made of up with people with surname of Huang and Chen. But, it seems my YDNA is more common with the Huang. Thus, possibly my paternal ancestors could have adopted the Chen surname, but had the surname Huang before that.