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Post by Doug 周 on Nov 17, 2018 2:54:08 GMT -5
... 司徒佑荃 Seto Yew Shuen = 司徒阿為 Seto Ah Wai... FayChee , your zupu document has Chinese simplified characters so Ah Wai (simplified)= 阿为. Maybe you can find the Wai character that Jason digitized off the photo?
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Post by FayChee on Nov 17, 2018 9:41:44 GMT -5
Hi Doug, Yes, I will also look for the 'Wai' characters as well as different generations other than just Gen 24 and Gen 26.
Maybe I will wait until we hear back about the pictures that were sent to the Village Head....
Fay Chee
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Post by FayChee on Nov 17, 2018 10:29:05 GMT -5
Does anyone know if the Seyip version of 'Yew-thlen' is equivalent to 'You Quan' ?? An elderly Chinese lady who knew him said in Seyip dialect that his name was 'Yew-Thlen' ....
I can't see the similarity of the Seyip dialect 'thlen' to the Mandarin/Cantonese 'You Quan/Yew Shuen'
Fay Chee
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Post by FayChee on Nov 18, 2018 10:52:19 GMT -5
I still haven't heard from the Village Head, so I was re-reading the previous posts from page 1 and Jason Wu had a theory....
"Another loose theory, and I may be being too liberal with my specualtion here, is that "Yew Shuen" should be written as 佑萱 instead of 佑荃, pronounced "Yew Tuen," and perhaps 佑荃垣 was a jumbling of 佑萱 (sharing the parts 艹 and 亘)."
This seyip pronouciation looks closer to what the elderly lady said "the elderly Chinese lady who knew him said in Seyip dialect that his real name was 'Yew-Thlen' ...."
I will try looking in the Zupu for 佑萱 too.
Fay Chee
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Post by chakrajuices on Nov 18, 2018 19:08:11 GMT -5
This is the full headstone of my GF sorry I didn't think to post it completely until Fay asked me to...
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Post by FayChee on Nov 18, 2018 22:13:24 GMT -5
Thank you Chakrajuices. I am still researching..........
Fay Chee
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Post by lachinatown on Nov 19, 2018 1:06:00 GMT -5
Now that we see the English portion of the headstone, his Chinese name is Yew Shuen. The Chinese characters 佑荃垣 have the romanization of: You Quan (or Chuo) Yuan [Mandarin] or Yau Chyun Wun [Cantonese].
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Post by FayChee on Nov 19, 2018 7:31:23 GMT -5
Lachinatown, Thank you for clarifying the names. It will save me hours of searching for the other name 佑萱 .
Since there are only about 95 families in Dajinli, it should not be too hard for the Village Head to narrow down his family tree, especially with the story that one of his two sons, a School teacher, was murdered at the School when he went to investigate a break-in.
Fay Chee
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Post by Doug 周 on Nov 19, 2018 9:30:32 GMT -5
I know very little about paper son's and the economics in New Zealand. I have heard that there was the industry of paper sons in Australia and Canada because of laws similar to the US 1882 Exclusion Act. So I understand the American paper son dilemma. Can someone share a link or reference to the New Zealand paper son conundrum?
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Post by FayChee on Nov 19, 2018 10:16:25 GMT -5
Hi Doug,
I'm sorry, I used the term 'Paper-son' loosely due to my own experience with my dad immigrating to the US as 'Wing Gue Lew', a name he purchased from a family back in China. Only to find out that a similar situation with the writing on the tombstones that gave the Paper-son name or a Pseudo-name in English and the real Chinese name and hometown in Chinese Character.
This is all that I meant.....I don't know if the same happened with Chinese immigrating to New Zealand......I will remove that reference.
Fay Chee
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Post by helen on Nov 21, 2018 3:06:08 GMT -5
New Zealand did not have "paper sons" so to speak. We had the original Gold Miners and the Chinese merchants - supporting the miners. After the gold rush, those who did not make money, moved on to market gardens, laundries and fruit and vegetable shop keepers (aka green grocers). They travelled back and forward to China - about once every 10 years (marrying ; and leaving a child back in China each time)In 1939, during the japanese war, the NZ Government allowed the wives and children to come for up to 2 years. Any child born in NZ during that time, was supposed to go back to China after the 2 years was up. However, the Japanese war carried on - and eventually the Government allowed the families to stay. That was the start of Chinese families in NZ.
We didn't have any indentured people, like in Samoa, not railway workers.
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Post by FayChee on Nov 21, 2018 9:33:49 GMT -5
Thank you Helen for the excellent background information on Chinese immigration to New Zealand. It seems that the 'Paper son' phenomenon is mainly an American event due to 'Chinese Exclusion Act'.
Fay Chee
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Post by helen on Nov 22, 2018 3:46:19 GMT -5
Chinese New Zealanders – Limited Citizenship Although there were some constraints on Asians generally, the only people who were really restricted in terms of citizenship were the Chinese. Legal restrictions affected their migration to and from New Zealand, and their lives in this country from 1881 until 1986. The main records relating to Chinese are Alien and Naturalisation files, and Immigration records from the Labour Department archives. Many general records of interest to family historians, such as twentieth century immigration records [ADBO 16135 SS1], Notices of Intention to Marry [ADAQ 8937 BDM20], Probates and Coroners Reports, can also provide information on Chinese New Zealanders. Background Chinese labourers first arrived in 1866, having been invited by the Otago provincial government to re-work the gold fields of southern New Zealand. They were not assisted immigrants, so there are usually no immigration records. Most Chinese then, and later, came to New Zealand via Australia. In the 1870s, when strong anti-Chinese feeling first appeared in New Zealand, many were still living in Otago, but more than 1000 were also on the West Coast goldfields. The Chinese Immigrants Act 1881 levied a £10 entry or poll (head) tax on Chinese newcomers and decreed ships were to carry no more than one Chinese for each 10 tons of the ship’s weight. The Customs Department issued poll tax receipts and exemption certificates, but the records are now held under the Labour Department (see next column). Poll tax payment allowed Chinese to land and gain permanent residency, but they remained aliens, except for the few who were naturalised. The latter often spoke English before arrival. Many further acts restricted Chinese immigration to New Zealand, such as the raising of the poll tax to £100 in 1896. The ability of Chinese to become British citizens in New Zealand through naturalisation was prevented in 1908. There were three other periods when Chinese were allowed into New Zealand in significant numbers: after World War I 1918-1920, at the beginning of World War II 1939-1940 as refugees, and for a few years after World War II 1948-1951, but otherwise restrictions remained. Many of those who came were ‘students’ or relatives of Chinese already living in New Zealand. The poll tax was abolished in 1944 and in 1951 the government permitted the naturalisation of Chinese in New Zealand again. However, the number of Chinese immigrants remained relatively small – mostly chain migration of family members – and it was not until 1986 that the immigration status of Chinese and Europeans was made the same. archives.govt.nz/research/guides/citizenship#chinese%20new%20zealanders
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Post by chakrajuices on Nov 22, 2018 4:18:04 GMT -5
Thanks, great information Helen!
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Post by helen on Nov 22, 2018 4:31:10 GMT -5
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