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Post by douglaslam on Nov 22, 2008 6:48:30 GMT -5
I notice our big guns viz Geoff, Henry, Ahgin, Helen, laohuaqiao, Raymond ( I must have missed many more), are falling silent. Perhaps we are in need of a stimulating challenge, a new target to take aim at.
I am starting a new thread and inviting everyone to contribute. It is a hotch-potch of ideas, reflections, observations, anecdotal incidences, reminiscences of mundane everyday things pertaining to Chinese communities world wide. For examples, we may reflect on our impressions of China on the first and subsequent visits. We may compare and contrast different Chinatowns visited. There must be countless human stories; stories that make us laugh, cringe, or simply humorous to be told. I, myself and tyuti1668, could recount China of yesteryear, stories of the old timers returning from the Gold Mt. as we were both born and raised in China. I have seen and heard a good deal of goings-on in Sydney's Chinatown over the decades, and I would like to share a few of them with members and guests.
Let me kick it off by starting not at Sydney but Vancouver: I am in frequent telephone contact with my aunt and her husband in LA. They are in their eighties and nineties respectively. They arrived in the US in the 60s as refugees from Cuba.Unfortunately my aunt is now suffering from dementia, but my uncle is still sharp as a tack. He told me of a trip to Vancouver soon after their arrival in Florida, to see my grandfather ( my aunt's father). The one thing that seared in uncle's mind was the sight of many old Chinese men sitting on the footpath (sidewalk to some of you) in Keefer St. sunning themselves in the winter sun. Many of them were in rags. They visited grandfather's house which he shared with many other old men. He witnessed some of the old men cooking a measly meal for me. They gave their best years to Canada, and ended up in utter loneliness and hardship in old age.
It was a poignant statement of the devastation that befell the Chinese community in Canada because of the Head Tax and The Chinese Exclusion Act. My heart aches for what my grandfather had suffered for decades, in order to provide for us back in Chungshan.
Douglas
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Post by Henry on Nov 22, 2008 11:08:19 GMT -5
Hi Douglas, I remember first visiting Vancouver in the early 1980s and it was this sleepy little place with a quiet Chinatown on Pender street. My recent visits have witness an amazing transformation of this city that now hosts about a third of the Chinese population, the largest minority, within Canada. This change, largely due to the migration of wealthy Hong Kong Chinese, resulted from the return of British Hong Kong to China. I love all the wonderful Chinese shopping malls and the high quality of food from the Chinese restaurants, dim sum, noodle places, and Chinese bakeries, etc, in Richmond. There are many SiYi Forum members that live in the greater Vancouver area that can also provide us with stories of how Chinese Canadians have had to struggle and deal with the prejudice and discrimination. But, this is only one instance of what many overseas Chinese in other countries have had to contend with and overcome - even to this day. But, despite all these impediments, overseas Chinese have prevailed and managed to survive and prosper - it is this determination and resilient spirit that I most admire and which I feel enables overseas Chinese to be a unique breed of Chinese. My contribution today is the following excerpt: Chinese people and political change in Australia Fong, K. From: A White Australia to a multicultural society 1997: When I arrived in Sydney in 1946 as a 8 year old student, Australia's Immigration Policy was under the White Australia legislation which was passed by the Australian Commonwealth Parliament in 1901. Chinese from China began arriving into Melbourne and Sydney in the 1850's and by 1861 there were 38 300 Chinese Males in Australia and eleven Chinese Females. California, USA was known as the Old Gold Mountain and Australia became to be known as the New Gold Mountain. However, in 1861 in the gold mining town of Lambing Flat a Riot took place against the Chinese miners and the Anti-Chinese movement continued in other mining places throughout the States of Victoria and New South Wales. In 1901 the White Australia Policy was adopted. In 1901 the Chinese male population in Australia was 32 700 and 474 Chinese females. In 1946 when I arrived in Sydney there were about 12 000 Chinese males and about 2 500 Chinese females in Australia. After the gold rush period in the 1880s most of the Chinese miners went into business in the local towns and gradually many who were able to save enough money were allowed to sponsor their wife and son or sons. They had to survive under the restrictive Immigration Policy. Many became outstanding citizens and played important commercial roles in the Community. In Sydney, Chinatown in the 1860s was based along Wentworth avenue and Wexford Street, Surry Hills. Gradually when the Markets were built in Campbell Street (currently the Capital Theatre site) Chinese were concentrated in Campbell Street and became Sydney's Chinatown from the 1920s. When the Paddy's Markets and the large Wholesale Markets were built in the late 1930s, a new shift of the Chinese businesses were concentrated along Dixon Street, Hay and Lackey Streets. In 1966 the Australian government saw the need to improve relations with the Asian countries specially for trade as England was more involved in the European Common Market. Gradually the White Australia Policy was being phased out and more skilled, professional and large investors from South East Asia were allowed. In 1975 after the Vietnam War, many Refugees from South Vietnam were allowed into Australia and our Australian population continued to increase. The social needs also increased and Australia became a more dominant country in the Asian and Pacific region. Sydney's Dixon Street became Sydney's Chinatown in 1980 after negotiations by the Sydney City Council and the Dixon Street property Owners and business Owners jointly raised funds to build the Ceremonial Archways, Lions, pavilion, seats, garden beds etc. Mr. Henry Tsang (our current Deputy Lord Mayor) was our Honorary Architect. Our Dixon Street Chinese Committee Chairman was Mr Stanley Wong, MBE with great support from Mr. Bernard Chan, Mr. Alen Lai, Mr. Henry Ming Lai, and Mr. Siu Wah Wong, MBE etc. The Australian Census shows in 1947 there were 12 100 Chinese in Australia with 3 300 living in Sydney. In 1966, 26 700 Chinese were in Australia with 9 943 living in Sydney. In 1986 there were 172 000 of Chinese ancestry in Australia with 58 500 living in Sydney. In 1991 the total using the Chinese language at home total over 251 000 in Australia with 125 000 living in Sydney. In the latest Census, there were 324 000 persons using the Chinese language at home with about 170 000 in Sydney. An interesting comparison shows in the 1996 census, 48.8% of the total Chinese speaking population lives in New South Wales (probably 75% in Sydney) compared to 28% living in Victoria (75% in 9.1 % living in Queensland and 8.4% living in Western Australia. Other States have smaller percentages. Therefore, our role in society is increasing and the importance of our Multicultural Society is becoming more dominant as we reach the Year 2000 with the Olympics and hopefully continuous economic progress. In Australia, we have three tiers of Government and we are becoming more aware of the various needs to liaise with the three tiers of Government. Election time is always a new challenge and we should think carefully when we exercise our democratic opportunity to elect our Members of Parliament… King Fong, OAM., JP. Public Relations Consultant, 1997. Another informative monograph is: Chinese Settlement in NSW: A Thematic History: Appendices and bibliography ... Looks at the contribution of Chinese settlement to the heritage of NSW This 64 page PDF document is available free and can be downloaded from: www.shop.nsw.gov.au/pubdetails.jsp?publication=5456If this does not turn you on, then try the following Cantonese rap: Enjoy, Henry
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Post by geoff on Nov 22, 2008 15:31:04 GMT -5
Hello Douglas,
Great idea to start this new thread.
My ancestors arrived the "New Gold Mountain" nearly a hundred years before K Fong's arrival in 1946. They had to endure the "anti chinese movement" & restrictions for nearly 50 years, before it was legislated in the 1901 Australian Immigration Restriction Act.
Quote from above...."Chinese from China began arriving into Melbourne and Sydney in the 1850's and by 1861 there were 38 300 Chinese Males in Australia".
My maternal great grandfather was one of those "38,300 Chinese Males in Aust". He arrived in Melbourne, Australia in 1856 (aged 18), became a tea merchant & spent the rest of his life there. He returned to China at least 3 times, twice to marry & finally "to lay in peace". He, 2 wives & children lived & worked in Melbourne's chinatown, a far cry from his rural village life in China.
Paternal gggfather was one of those typical Chinese young men (aged 18) seeking their fortune in the "New Gold Mountain". He started as a goldminer & within 5 to 7 years of his arrival in Australia, he was also a storekeeper. It amazes me how quickly he adapted to life & doing business in outback Victoria. Later, his family & nephew joined him in Sydney, where he went onto having partnerships & 100% owning market gardens & poultry farms. Chinese had to group together for survival. We admire him for his hard work & dedication to his family.
Please tell us about your experiences in Sydney & anywhere else in Australia.
Geoff
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Post by douglaslam on Nov 23, 2008 6:39:54 GMT -5
To Henry and Geoff, Henry never ceases to amaze me with the depth of his knowledge in overseas Chinese. Geoff, I am sure would have many interesting tales to tell of his family's long history downunder.
I know King Fong well. His father uprooted the family from Fiji to settle in Sydney. By doing so, the Fong family left a lasting legacy on Sydney's Chinatown history. Geoff would concur with me that Say Tin Fong & Co was one of two major Chinese emporiums in Sydney before the proliferation of the ones in suburbia from the late 70s onward. Both emporiums were badly damaged in a fire in November 1985, subsequently the old building was pulled down to make way for modern development. With that, part of Sydney's colourful history literally went up in smoke.
On the upper levels of the building, there were three floors set aside as tenement hall, boarding house for the single lonely males. At the peak there were over 90 cubicles, most of them windowless. It provided cheap accommodation for the Chinese males who couldn't go back or had no family to go back to in China. The place had a pervading dank and musty smell. I know because my uncle lived there for several years until his untimely death. King always resisted putting the rent up for the destitute, and voiceless old men marooned in Australia ,most of them victims of the White Australia policy.
The 1997 article also mentioned the Dixon St. Committee, I think all of them had passed on. I knew all but one of them. Bernard Chan was the richest Chinese fellow then, he was the Sze Yup philanthropist who made available valuable floor space at nominal rent as the association's club house. Stanley Wong was murdered by a Malaysian Chinese male. That same man I took on as a boarder in my rented flat, to help make ends meet. I asked him to move because he owed me 13 weeks in back rent. I was doing it tough in the early 80s, my family of four crammed into one room, so that I could sub-let the other one. We had just the one income, my wife had to care for our young children, and I also had to support my mother in China. Then there was Siu Wah Wong, he was from Geoff''s ancestral county Dongguan,, I knew him best because I served him almost daily as a customer. Wong was also known as the Sausage King, he made amongst other things Chinese sausages. Because of his lack of English, he often asked me to clarify the day's political issues for him.
I hope I am not being long-winded on this piece of trivia. Come on everybody, let's have some of your mundane everyday things aired.
Douglas
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Post by geoff on Nov 23, 2008 15:12:59 GMT -5
Hello Douglas,
Up until mid 1880's, we travelled from the suburb to Sydney's Chinatown to buy our chinese groceries & to eat in a chinese restaurant. Following the increased migration from Asia, from late 1970's, there are now large chinese grocery stores in some of the larger suburban shopping centres & at least 1 chinese restaurant in most suburbs of Sydney.We don't have to travel to "Chinatown" anymore, which saves time & energy. We now only travel to "Sydney's Chinatown" once a year for a "look". Activity in Chinatown hasn't decreased eventhough the move has been to the suburbs.
As Douglas mentioned, even "Chinatown" has changed. The former wholesale fruit & veg market building has been transformed into 3 levels of shopping. Once you walk in you feel like you're in Hong Kong. The former growers market was demolished & replaced by "The Sydney Entertainment Centre", where musical performances & some indoor sports events (a venue for basketball at 2000 Sydney Olympics) are held.
One of the streets in Sydney's Chinatown has been closed off to traffic & transformed into a pedestrian mall. There is outside dining infront of some of the restaurants. Walking along Dixon Street is much more pleasant now.
Just a small correction, the Yips originate from Dongguan while both sides of my family originate from neighbouring Zengcheng (Jungseng in cantonese).
Let's hear more about "your local chinese community". Are they different or similar? If so, how?
Geoff
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Post by Ah Gin on Nov 24, 2008 0:12:28 GMT -5
Douglas, Henry, Geoff et al,
Sorry, this old man was out of touch for a while -- many domestic things to catch up after the memorable and wonderful "in search of" heritage journey, and I realised I am not as young as I think :-).
Reflection is always a good thing for the soul. History is also a good teacher, except that most of us (and that includes me) are poor students.
I arrived in Sydney, in time to see the "It's Time" slogan painted on the floor of railway stations. It was the start of change in politics in Australia (roughly from Conservative to Labor), and it was near the beginning of the demise of the "White Australian Policy". Indeed as Geoff and Douglas reflected, getting Chinese food meant that you had to go to Chinatown. Our simple answer was: grow our own choy sum, bak choi -- anything. We even considered making our own tofoo and growing bean sprouts.
Work life took me to Melbourne. And Melbourne Chinatown was not quite like Sydney Chinatown. So every time I had an excuse to visit Sydney on a day return trip, I brought home a roast duck. Pity the next passenger on flight, wondering where that Chinese roast smell is from?
How things have changed after nearly 30 plus years. Like you folks we only visit Chinatown for fun. Our daily Chinese supply is simply obtainable 10 minutes away. There are many local Chinatowns in the suburbs, just as they have in places like San Francisco, Sydney, and of course New York. Soy Sauce comes in many brands, style, price, country of origin. Every other things have the familiar "Made in China" stamp. And that's the point. Chinese business is good business for everyone.
For fun (some might say we are odd fellows), we do a bit of Chinese history research (period of interest, say between 1850s to slightly into Australian Federation). Some areas of interest to us include: Correspondence at the Colonial Office level, Inquests, Wills and Probates. A great deal of the stories we came across are sad. Yet amongst the stories, there are stories which make us proud to be a Chinese. There are distinct "Chinese values" that came through -- mutual help,doing good for the common people, contributing to the development of hospitals -- there are plenty Chinese names on the books of the relevant institutions.
Even though it was "The 19th Century", and communication was difficult (gee, what is blue tooth. We had yellow tooth), in fact we found that the Chinese pioneers, and that's what they are, pioneers, have ways of dealing with business, not only amongst themselves, but with the Colonial Masters or fellow Colonial imates, even if they were mean to us. But to be fair, they were also mean to the Irish, mean to the people in Tasmania (they killed them all, buy "attrition" and nice sicknesses)
Looking back at the Australian Colonial peiod, and the period within our living memory since we arrived in Australia, and indeed in countries where there is a large and significant population of Chinese migrants (e.g. Malaya, Singapore, SE Asia), the Chinese and its decendends have excelled, mostly. They are in politics, business, science and medical field and yes, they are criminals too.
Years ago, for the Chinese, the Say Yup (aka Siyi) Society held things together. Of course some would argue that point. Now, there are just too many self interest groups -- all Chinese mind you, but ever so different. What will that lead us to.
I hasten to add that I have no wish to start or continue a thread which has a political undertone. Think this is the wrong forum for that.
That said, my concern is the preservation of the proud heritage that is Chinese, and in the context of the nation that is our own, ie, Australia (or the US, or Canada, or New Zealand, or where ever you live).
It is with delight I observe that many nations, such as the US, Australia, Canada, New Zealand and many more, there is encouragement (or at least no discouragement) to preserve "things Chinese" -- including Roots research. For that, there is a role for this Forum to play.
Until the next posting, Ah Gin, having a cup of Iron Buddha tea, and reflecting -- life is better now for us than our parents -- and that was their hope, was it not? And the Pearl River Delta Region is looking quite good as well.
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Post by douglaslam on Nov 24, 2008 6:53:13 GMT -5
Geoff, Glad you weighed in with your observation of now and then. Everyone of us have our own Chinese experience to share, I'd like to hear it from members and visitors.
Henry said it quite rightly, our determination and resilience ensured our long term survival and prosperity no matter where. For example,there was no laundry business in China, yet in the New World it was synonymous with our early pioneers.
Just as Ah Gin said life is good now. But lets look back at how things were in our own times, from my arrival about 47 years ago as a confused, apprehensive, and naive teenager to the present, in the spirit of the topic...".Lighter side, and things which don't belong to any groups." Let's wind back the years.
Take the restaurant trade, in the early 60s, I used to work weekend evenings in a Chinese restaurant. Many owners were Hainanese seamen who were stranded in Australia at the outbreak of WW II. After a protracted battle was won against deportation when hostilities ceased, they literally jumped ship, and opened up restaurants for a living. Few of them were trained cooks, thus the standards were poor, but customer expectations were also low then. I worked in one such Hainanese-run restaurant.
Every Chinese restaurant used to offer so-called Chinese and Australian meals. Aussie meals may include T bone steak, mixed grill, chicken Maryland, chicken or prawn salad, crumbed cutlets and the like. Chinese meal ingredients were mainly cabbage, carrot, celery and onion. No Chinese veg. at all. Things are different now, you can choose fish, lobsters and abalones in the tank, at a price of course.
I did the dishes, also doubled up as waiter when needed. At the time there were very few female Chinese, the owners had to take on non-Chinese women as waitresses.
There was advantage in hiring non-Chinese women. Only they could deal with the difficult customers. At closing time especially, they simply asked the customers to pay up so that they could go home. For a Chinese person to say the same thing, he or she would be inviting trouble. The diners would stay on and on to annoy you.
I remember there was a waitress called Margot, she was only a diminutive woman. If there were really troublesome customers, she simply picked up the phone and called her son," Jim, its Mum, come over". Minutes later, her son would appear. Now, Jim was an amateur boxing champ, with bulging muscle in a tight-fit T-shirt. A bit like Arnie. Before he had finished saying "what's the problem, mate", the troublemakers got their cue pay up and go.
Can anyone tell me how different things are now, and how they used to deal with stragglers?
Douglas
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Post by geoff on Nov 24, 2008 15:28:06 GMT -5
Douglas,
I remember the Chinese & Australian menu which included a few Aussie dishes as you mention. Most chinese restaurants in Sydney don't include the Aussie dishes anymore. These days you'll need to go to an "outback" chinese cafe to have an "aussie meal". For many years the country chinese cafe was the only place to dine out. Now they face competition from clubs that also provide chinese meals as well as other franchised eat in or take aways. Many folk in country towns have fond memories of the "Chinese family" who ran the local chinese cafe. The weekly customer gradually got to know the "Chinese family" & how could the waiter forget the customer's favourites such as chicken chow mein or large fried rice or sweet & sour pork with canned lychees on a special occasion.
Geoff
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Post by Ah Gin on Nov 24, 2008 17:55:57 GMT -5
Douglas, Geoff,
Ah, we drifted to the Chinese favourite subject -- food. Let's have a reflection on the Overseas Chinese menu/food inventions: Kung Pow Chicken, Fortune Cookie, Chicko Roll (for the non Aussies, Chicko Roll is something like an Industrial Strength Spring Roll, made for He Men, to be eaten with can of beer on one hand, and the "spring roll" (that does not spring at all) on the other hand, fish and chip shop made "Dim Sim", chop sui. And how many types of "prawn crackers" there are now a days? I always thought and have the theory that the Chinese would adopt and adapt local ingridients, cater to local taste and invent / evolve the dishes. In Management Schools, they call that "customer focus" or giving what the customers want. And don't forget the fashionable "Ketchup Manis" aka very thick black soy sauce for "red cook" or Hokkien, Malaysian style noodle.
Now a days, walk into a Buffet-style restaurant, in say, Las Vagas, you find a Chinese section as well,of Chinese-adapted food.
Ah food, glorious food. And the point of this observation is that the Chinese Family Restaurant, cook, chef will adapt, adopt and offer what the customers want. And interestingly, the Chinese Heritage once again shines through.
Cheers, or is it yum shing. Regards, Ah Gin
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Post by helen on Nov 25, 2008 2:52:48 GMT -5
Hey you guys have great memories. How come, I in New Zealand have none? Having grown up in a small town, with limited number of Chinese - I have no memories like yours. Just the double tenth gathering in the big city - the chefs being the local men from around the province organising 10 course meal. While the ladies and children went to watch the latest Chinese opera at the movies. Other occasions were when we finally sent off the bank orders to Kwong Ye Loong in Hong Kong - a postal service for overseas Chinese. We had a catelogue where we children were allowed to chhose the latest Hong Kong jacket - we were the only ones in town with one. Mum ordered her dried scallops, shrimps, beche de mere and mushrooms. The soup mix - (Ching bo leung), dried melon, dried plums, wah mui, chan pei mui,. when the package arrived it was red letter day.
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Post by helen on Nov 25, 2008 2:58:46 GMT -5
Mum made all our food from scratch - noodles, wontons, cooked the rice in a pot on the stove, and the fight over the "crunchy" parts from the bottom of the pot - soaked in tea. After father killed the chooks or ducks, she would be the one plucking the feathers - in a big pot of boiling water, in the back yard. Lucky for us, we had no near neighbours who could see the headless duck running around the yard, whilst we were screaming.
Nights and weekends were spend at the market garden - weeding and picking crop. lucky we didnt live in the gardens, unlike some of the other i know.
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Post by helen on Nov 25, 2008 3:00:04 GMT -5
www.goodreads.com/story/show/12302.Chopsticks_in_the_Land_of_CottonCheck out John Jung's latest book - how Chinese immigrants found their way to the Mississippi River Delta in the late 1800s and earned their living operating small family grocery stores in neighborhoods where mostly black cotton plantation workers lived. What was their status in the segregated black and white world of that region? How did this small group maintain their culture and ethnic identity? What has happened to these merchants and their families over the years?
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Post by geoff on Nov 25, 2008 6:14:26 GMT -5
Still on our favourite subject........FOOD
On our way to Sydney's Royal Easter Show in the 1960's &70's, we'd call into the Nankin Cafe in Campbell St & later in Elizabeth St, to buy our takeaway lunch. The chinese must have also invented takeways! As we walked around the showground, munching on the freshly made dim sims, bbq pork buns, gow gees & their famous spring rolls, we'd get comments like "where do you buy that kinda food?", "looks delicious" & "hey, what's it called?". Food certainly is a leveller. The spring roll was nearly the size of a long hot dog roll, not the tiny finger size spring roll you're served at yum cha. It was a meal in itself.
There used to be a chinese cooked food store in Campbell St called Kai Yuen. As a child, it was fascinating seeing the live chicks & ducks being carried into the shop in cages while their older cousins were on display in the front window or hanging naked in the frig. There were also live crabs lying in bamboo baskets near the 100 day eggs, just below the shelves of all different types of choys. One could see animal life in the big city without having to go to the farm. Douglas, do you remember?
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Post by douglaslam on Nov 25, 2008 6:24:27 GMT -5
Ah Gin, You are forgetting the latter additions to the menu. Just as the Americans have their chop suey, in Oz our creative chefs in the big cities came up with lemon chicken and honey prawns. Also spare a thought for our brothers and sisters in Inner Mongolia, we have Mongolian lamb on offer in most restaurants. They don't know what they are missing out on. Poor buggers !!
And Helen, you are selling yourself well short, your memories are priceless, and equally colourful and fascinating.
Yes, I did read Southern Fried Rice, and John Jung's family story online. I also read about the Chinese shopkeepers in America's deep south. It is awe-inspiring. They were truely walking the tightrope, performing a very delicate balancing act of empathysing with the African-Americans as they were the main source of their customers, and yet not to be seen by the White racists as betraying their cause. Perhaps not speaking much English did help. The shopkeepers always kept one sample of every item in stock, not for sale at any price. For this was the only way they could re-stock by showing the travelling salesman the item.
My admiration for our early pioneers knows no bounds. There were no obstacles they could not overcome. Long may the descendants of the Dragon prosper. I am proud to be a member of the big tribe.
Douglas
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Post by douglaslam on Nov 25, 2008 6:38:58 GMT -5
Geoff, You beat me to the punch by posting seconds ahead of me. Of course, I am familiar with the places you mentioned. I like the old Showground better, it is not as sterile as the new one. I used to go on Good Friday each year, as we only shut for two days each year, Christmas and Good Friday. Life was all work and not much play then.
Douglas
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