Finding Andrew Pang - with much help.
Jan 15, 2014 7:31:44 GMT -5
Post by lolly on Jan 15, 2014 7:31:44 GMT -5
I first learned that my paternal grandfather was Chinese around the 1960s. However, for reasons that still remain a mystery, my father either avoided or refused ever talking about him or revealing any information at all about his childhood memories. And that refusal was not only peculiar to my father, but also seemed to apply to the majority of his eight siblings.
In deference to my father’s wishes, there was no attempt made to delve further into our chinese heritage until after his death in 1993. Unfortunately that left me with very few sources to consult. My best option was my aunt’s family who had formerly lived in Sydney but had since moved to northern NSW. On the few occasions when they were approached, the response was “Let the past stay in the past”. So for the next 16 years, the only information I was able to acquire was the marriage certificate for Andrew Hong Pang, cabinetmaker, from Canton China, to my grandmother, a third generation Australian of Irish descent. The names of Andrew’s parents were deciphered as Pang Chuck Fay and Kong Lau (which proved to be an incorrect “guess” for his mother)
It was not until 2009, after the death another brother, that my Uncle Denis expressed a wish to know more about his ancestry . And so we began with whatever he knew or could recall.
I learned that Andrew had been living in Sydney and found his death certificate in the NSW State Records online. The record showed that he was buried at Rookwood Cemetery.
A search of The National Archives of Australia, again online, produced 3 very informative documents – Alien Registration Forms required for War Precautions and Alien’ s Control. The first application was in 1916 in Melbourne, the other two were lodged in Sydney in 1939 and 1948 (replacement for stolen certificate). These forms were absolute treasures as there were photographs attached to the two Sydney applications and a physical description was also on the form.
A lot of googling around followed, trying assorted and varied subject lines, and picking up lots of very informative background material, and then I stumbled onto the Chinese Genealogy site, siyigenealogy.proboards.com/ in August 2013.
I have not posted on many forums, but what did I have to lose? I could never have imagined how much I had to gain! In a nutshell, I had immediate responses to my posting. You can read how my thread progressed in: siyigenealogy.proboards.com/thread/1924/andrew-haong-guangdong-province-xiang
Amongst the offerings of assistance was the incredible message from Douglas Lam. He is from a neighbouring village to my grandfather, speaks the same dialect, was due to travel to China in November 2013, and offered to visit my grandfather’s ancestral village and learn what he could on my behalf. Armed with the details that I had received from Godfrey Mar and the couple of pictures of Andrew that I was able to provide, Douglas, with the help of his local village brothers located our ancestral village, conferred with the village official and returned with a copy of the village genealogy records pertaining to Andrew and his ancestors. Douglas kept the forum well entertained with a log of his journey on siyigenealogy.proboards.com/thread/1181/excellent-adventures-china beginning around page 45.
I travelled to Sydney last week with my Uncle Denis to meet with Douglas for the “official” handover of the records. We met at the Marigold restaurant in Chinatown to partake of a delicious Yum Cha lunch in celebration of the success of Douglas’ “mission”.
The moment of truth. Douglas is ready to reveal the contents of Andrew Pang's records, and I am very much ready to receive them.
I have no knowledge of cantonese or chinese characters. Douglas carefully tried to explain what was before me.
It occurred to me too late that it would have been advantageous to have recorded our meeting on a video or even tape recorder at the very least. I was so excited at the prospect of all I was about to learn that I am sure I have not properly retained all that Douglas conveyed to me.
A surprise treat that Douglas found in China and brought back for me. The keyring has the character for the name Pang. Douglas bought the whole of the vendor's stock. Uncle Denis was quite delighted, and my sister will also be chuffed!
Douglas had also mailed me a booklet about Sing Sze from China, given to him by the very helpful village official. We compared the pictures in he booklet with those that Douglas had taken himself.
Meanwhile, our most inviting lunch was being enjoyed around us by my husband Bill, Uncle Denis, and our newly found friend, Susan Pang. Douglas was so busy with his infectiously enthusiastic recounting and detailing of everything possible that he barely took the time to eat. It was a wonderful gathering and we were very well looked after.
Some three hours later we finally left the Marigold and took a walk through the Dixon St precinct which my grandfather had frequented. Susan recalled seeing him there when she was a young child. She was also able to show us the location where one of our few pictures we have of him was taken. Both Douglas and Susan gave a running commentary on how the street had changed. Uncle Denis was able to recall many of the places referred to from his earlier visits to Chinatown back in the late 1900s and thoroughly enjoyed the whole experience.
Douglas still had one more activity to complete our day. We headed to a quieter spot for a cup of coffee, and Douglas placed a phone call to China to my third cousin's wife, Mrs Pang.
Douglas spoke to Mrs Pang at length and described just what we were all up to. I got to say "Hello" .... but that was all we could manage that we could understand. Douglas let Mrs Pang know that I would be sending her some pictures of Andrew's (Hung Pint) family in Australia. I hope her children will be able to help translate my captions for her.
It was a wonderful day for me. We have so much to thank Douglas for. He describes himself as a foot soldier who can go out into the field and do some probing. It is apparent that he derives a great deal of pleasure from the successes that he achieves and the absolute delight it gives to those he is able to help. You are much appreciated Douglas.
My Uncle Denis finds it almost incomprehensible that we have come so far. Our expectations had not been high. We have been very very lucky to find this forum and the help and encouragement of its members. We thank you all.
However, this is just the beginning. I am now setting about the task of translating all the cantonese material that I am accumulating. I have an initial contact to make a start. I am also trawling through the many threads and posts on this site that recommend paths to follow. I will continue to add to this thread as I find options that work for me. I doubt that learning to speak or read cantonese is a realistic goal at this point in time!
To finish off this post on a lovely note, my party of three returned to the Marigold for lunch the next day, and took time to really savour the food again. We also took a stroll through the beautiful Chinese Friendship Gardens. It was a beautiful way to conclude this excellent visit to Sydney.
In deference to my father’s wishes, there was no attempt made to delve further into our chinese heritage until after his death in 1993. Unfortunately that left me with very few sources to consult. My best option was my aunt’s family who had formerly lived in Sydney but had since moved to northern NSW. On the few occasions when they were approached, the response was “Let the past stay in the past”. So for the next 16 years, the only information I was able to acquire was the marriage certificate for Andrew Hong Pang, cabinetmaker, from Canton China, to my grandmother, a third generation Australian of Irish descent. The names of Andrew’s parents were deciphered as Pang Chuck Fay and Kong Lau (which proved to be an incorrect “guess” for his mother)
It was not until 2009, after the death another brother, that my Uncle Denis expressed a wish to know more about his ancestry . And so we began with whatever he knew or could recall.
I learned that Andrew had been living in Sydney and found his death certificate in the NSW State Records online. The record showed that he was buried at Rookwood Cemetery.
A search of The National Archives of Australia, again online, produced 3 very informative documents – Alien Registration Forms required for War Precautions and Alien’ s Control. The first application was in 1916 in Melbourne, the other two were lodged in Sydney in 1939 and 1948 (replacement for stolen certificate). These forms were absolute treasures as there were photographs attached to the two Sydney applications and a physical description was also on the form.
A trip to Sydney in 2010, and a visit to the Rookwood Cemetery provided a defining moment in my thus far minimal research results. Andrew’s headstone bore the inscription: Erected by Brothers of Chinese Masonic Society and also was engraved with chinese characters.
A letter written to the Chinese Masonic Society of Sydney was followed up nearly a year later with a repeat letter . This included the addition of some pictures showing Andrew involved in Chinese cultural activities of lion dancing parades and theatre/opera groups ( the northern NSW cousins had discovered and shared these pics ). Five months later (2012) I received a call from Godfrey Mar from the CMS, and he advised that he had in fact known Andrew, particularly as a gifted lion dancer. Godfrey then sent me a letter giving me Andrew’s name and birth place complete with the chinese characters for village, city and province. Little did I know at the time that this was exactly the information I needed to progress the research.A lot of googling around followed, trying assorted and varied subject lines, and picking up lots of very informative background material, and then I stumbled onto the Chinese Genealogy site, siyigenealogy.proboards.com/ in August 2013.
I have not posted on many forums, but what did I have to lose? I could never have imagined how much I had to gain! In a nutshell, I had immediate responses to my posting. You can read how my thread progressed in: siyigenealogy.proboards.com/thread/1924/andrew-haong-guangdong-province-xiang
Amongst the offerings of assistance was the incredible message from Douglas Lam. He is from a neighbouring village to my grandfather, speaks the same dialect, was due to travel to China in November 2013, and offered to visit my grandfather’s ancestral village and learn what he could on my behalf. Armed with the details that I had received from Godfrey Mar and the couple of pictures of Andrew that I was able to provide, Douglas, with the help of his local village brothers located our ancestral village, conferred with the village official and returned with a copy of the village genealogy records pertaining to Andrew and his ancestors. Douglas kept the forum well entertained with a log of his journey on siyigenealogy.proboards.com/thread/1181/excellent-adventures-china beginning around page 45.
I travelled to Sydney last week with my Uncle Denis to meet with Douglas for the “official” handover of the records. We met at the Marigold restaurant in Chinatown to partake of a delicious Yum Cha lunch in celebration of the success of Douglas’ “mission”.
It occurred to me too late that it would have been advantageous to have recorded our meeting on a video or even tape recorder at the very least. I was so excited at the prospect of all I was about to learn that I am sure I have not properly retained all that Douglas conveyed to me.
A surprise treat that Douglas found in China and brought back for me. The keyring has the character for the name Pang. Douglas bought the whole of the vendor's stock. Uncle Denis was quite delighted, and my sister will also be chuffed!
Douglas had also mailed me a booklet about Sing Sze from China, given to him by the very helpful village official. We compared the pictures in he booklet with those that Douglas had taken himself.
Meanwhile, our most inviting lunch was being enjoyed around us by my husband Bill, Uncle Denis, and our newly found friend, Susan Pang. Douglas was so busy with his infectiously enthusiastic recounting and detailing of everything possible that he barely took the time to eat. It was a wonderful gathering and we were very well looked after.
Some three hours later we finally left the Marigold and took a walk through the Dixon St precinct which my grandfather had frequented. Susan recalled seeing him there when she was a young child. She was also able to show us the location where one of our few pictures we have of him was taken. Both Douglas and Susan gave a running commentary on how the street had changed. Uncle Denis was able to recall many of the places referred to from his earlier visits to Chinatown back in the late 1900s and thoroughly enjoyed the whole experience.
Douglas still had one more activity to complete our day. We headed to a quieter spot for a cup of coffee, and Douglas placed a phone call to China to my third cousin's wife, Mrs Pang.
Douglas spoke to Mrs Pang at length and described just what we were all up to. I got to say "Hello" .... but that was all we could manage that we could understand. Douglas let Mrs Pang know that I would be sending her some pictures of Andrew's (Hung Pint) family in Australia. I hope her children will be able to help translate my captions for her.
It was a wonderful day for me. We have so much to thank Douglas for. He describes himself as a foot soldier who can go out into the field and do some probing. It is apparent that he derives a great deal of pleasure from the successes that he achieves and the absolute delight it gives to those he is able to help. You are much appreciated Douglas.
My Uncle Denis finds it almost incomprehensible that we have come so far. Our expectations had not been high. We have been very very lucky to find this forum and the help and encouragement of its members. We thank you all.
However, this is just the beginning. I am now setting about the task of translating all the cantonese material that I am accumulating. I have an initial contact to make a start. I am also trawling through the many threads and posts on this site that recommend paths to follow. I will continue to add to this thread as I find options that work for me. I doubt that learning to speak or read cantonese is a realistic goal at this point in time!
To finish off this post on a lovely note, my party of three returned to the Marigold for lunch the next day, and took time to really savour the food again. We also took a stroll through the beautiful Chinese Friendship Gardens. It was a beautiful way to conclude this excellent visit to Sydney.