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Post by douglaslam on Oct 25, 2016 10:50:43 GMT -5
This is a sequel to my other China visits over the years. Today is our prolific contributor Doug周'day. I've been to DJ's village LTW a few times and got to know the one person who matters the most in the clan genealogy record keeping, let's call him LC, very well. The awesome threesome: LC our man in LTW is on the left. He is as keen as they come in matters genealogy. DJ, he is interested in your project. It would be up to his son to establish contact with you but he is on his way to Beijing for a couple of days. When he returns, I'll call again to pass on your email to him and obtain his Wechat, Weibo or other social network accounts he might have so that you can talk to him person to person. The bad news is your great aunt's family all moved out of the village, some members might be in the US. LC said she might have married to someone from LTW, but Wong is her family name. This is a weighty parcel which LC wants me to pass on to you. People are still mistaking I am from the US. It is all about branches of the Joe clan in different parts of Guangdong in particular and China in general. I think the volumes were a handout to delegates of a Joe clan convention. Please tell me what to do with it. It is rather heavy for airmail or air freight, and certainly too heavy for me to take to Sydney with me. I can ask LC to hold them for you. Alternatively, I can leave it in China, and when you do make your trip to China, I'll have it send to your hotel. If there is anything more I can do on my next meeting with LC, please let me know.
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Post by Doug 周 on Oct 25, 2016 11:38:14 GMT -5
DL,
I will contact you via email and PM regarding arrangements for the information.
BTW: the project DL is alluding to is trying to get the Zhou Zupu of LTW online as a true searchable document (not just reproduction of the non digitized analog Zupu images).
I am saddened not to be able to find my grand aunt. If LC has any contact, I would appreciate it. I have a 王 Wong Zupu from LTW. If he know the name of the 王 Wong she married, I will try to find him. Any contact information with any of her family member would be appreciated.
DJ
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Post by douglaslam on Oct 26, 2016 11:02:01 GMT -5
I am having much trouble with internet connection at the place I am staying. The images I uploaded disappeared. Everything has to wait until my return to Sydney.
DJ, I am going to take the volumes of printed matter to Hong Kong. There, I'll seek out forwarders like DHL or FedEX for a qoute. My other option is to send them through Hong Kong Post by air mail or surface mail. They are cheaper and more dependable
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Post by Doug 周 on Oct 26, 2016 15:49:55 GMT -5
DL,
Whatever is easiest for you and does not adversely affect your plans. Advise me of my remittances to you.
With greatest appreciation,
DJ
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Post by tyuti1668 on Oct 26, 2016 19:48:30 GMT -5
...I'll seek out forwarders... China Post's SAL <空运水陆路包裹> also quite good... Why not ask the younger generation in Chungshan? Someone w/ e-shop background may know the best option to ship such heavy item...
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Post by douglaslam on Oct 27, 2016 19:44:22 GMT -5
Thank tyut1668. I'll give China Post one more try. Last year I tried to send two large photo prints to USA by post. I met with so many conditions and high cost that I was fed up with it. I took the article back to Sydney with me and send it by post, no questions asked.
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Post by chansomvia on Oct 27, 2016 22:44:36 GMT -5
Hi douglaslam
Glad you are keeping us posted of your 2nd adventure in China 2016. The pictures came our very well but need to be clicked, it looks very large and did not come out in-line. You see a symbol of a picture and it opens when you click it.
Cheers
Joe Chan
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Post by douglaslam on Oct 29, 2016 10:20:27 GMT -5
Hi Joe, I am still groping in the dark. Kaluosima or Carlos to us, is going to fix my laptop tomorrow. I clicked on things that I shouldn't and ended up with a lot of rubbish which slowed the PC considerably or worse, unresponsive. Carlos is settling in China well in his short stay. He is a very decisive, and makes sound decisions. I'll be having a long meeting with him and his China side of the family tomorrow over lunch. For members who aren't familiar with Carlos, please search my earlier postings under My Excellent Adventures in China.
I didn't post much for the last two years because of familiarity. I'll have more to show this time round.
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Post by douglaslam on Nov 1, 2016 10:27:21 GMT -5
DJ, the parcel is on its way via China Post by SAL as tyuti1668 suggested. It is much cheaper but would take up to a month I suppose, to get to you.
I had to use China Post's dispatch box, get my village brother Ming to fill in the sender bit as ID was needed. The form to fill in, was not in duplicate or triplicate but quint. and stamped three times on each page. Each volume was examined before putting in the box then sealed.
My meeting with LC from LTW did not go ahead. He was unavailable. Instead, we met Gina's Cheng people over long lunch. I have many photos to show, but the internet speed is torturous. I'll do it in the wee small hours or when I am back in Hong Kong or Sydney. DL
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Post by Doug 周 on Nov 1, 2016 11:00:36 GMT -5
DL,
A month is fine. Thank you. I am so indebted to you and others on this Forum
DJ
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Post by douglaslam on Nov 2, 2016 5:59:45 GMT -5
DJ, today is your day, and it has been a very productive one.
Only one companion was with me. We got to member lolly's ( remember her?)ancestral village first, on our way to a restaurant for lunch. LC came a little later with a fellow villager who works at night and spends his daytime leisure hours at the ancestral hall. I called on him on my first visit.
LTW actually has nine family names. 九子十三丁 In the beginning, fourteen persons came to settle in LTW from Dongguan 640 years ago. 周 Joe is the biggest on population count, just under 1,000 people. Out of the fourteen, they couldn't account for the name of four others. Internal migrants outnumber all villagers combined. 周 was from Hunan province but Dunyi alias 濂溪 was from Jiangxi 江西 province. He never set foot in Guangdong province, it was his great grandson who did. Dunyi was the equivalent of a modern day scientist to the imperial court.
LC and five others drove up to Jiangxi at Ching Ming time to the tomb of Dunyi, the progenitor, to pay their respects.
Now, about Joe Shoong. Joe Shoong's parents' grave was desecrated. Because it was in neglect for years, during sewerage works years ago, the combined grave was bulldozed. Gone. We know Joe Shoong's mother died during the war by Japanese bombing while crossing the sea from Hong Kong to Macau. Her body was never recovered. Her grave was just personal clothing, in our dialect, it is called coat and hat 袍帽 or formally 衣冠堟.
I asked to be shown Joe Shoong's home. I am in luck this time. There was someone there, an old spinster who lives alone. She is Shoong's grandniece. One half of the house was bricked off. It was anything but glamorous. Joe Shoong or other family members never spent money on its upkeep. She said no one benefited from his philanthropy. The house was used as a school by her grandmother. It was rare for a woman to learn to read and write, even rarer as a teacher in those years
The house was used as a play centre for preschool children. It was aptly called The Rose play centre or similar, obviously in honour of Joe Shoong's wife whose name in Chinese is Rose. Keen visitors often get up to the tall building opposite in order to get shots of the roof. It seems Joe Shoong has not quite lost his mystic pull.
Earlier in the year, there was a white couple stopped by. They were accompanied by a large media throng, government officials and an interpreter. They wanted to sit next to the old woman and hug her.I can only presume the woman might have been Joe Shoong's granddaughter or great-granddaughter. ( Doris' granddaughter?)
It was a good day out, I had much more to explore, questions to ask except my companion was getting impatient.
Photos in due course.
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Post by Doug 周 on Nov 4, 2016 10:47:58 GMT -5
Zhou Dunyi is a famous philosopher of the Song Dynasty ~1050 ACE . He is an important figure to the Zhou clan and dedicated Zhou genealogist try to trace their lineage to him. Wikipedia Article on Zhou Dunyi clickJoe Shoong is of the Zhou lineage and his ancestral village is (colloquially) LTW in Zhongshan. 龙头环(龍頭環) He is one of the first Chinese American millionaire and founded the National Dollar Store during the first half of the 20th century. He was a generous philanthropist to both his ancestral village and the Chinese American community. About Joe Shoong clickAs a Zhou from LTW, my grandfather was employed as a National Dollar Store manager and in related to Joe Shoong as outlined by this chart: The white couple who stopped by earlier in the year with the media presence were siblings and Joe Shoong's great grandchildren. The spinster told the media that she was Joe Shoong's brother (Joe Knox) granddaughter; I had asked DL to check in with her.
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Post by douglaslam on Nov 6, 2016 18:08:01 GMT -5
Last night I ate out with two of my junior relatives. It was a very low key and inexpensive event. Here it is in pictures. My next post would probably be in Hong Kong as I am about to pack up for my bus trip in three hours. This is the place we went to. Tyuti1668 would certainly know where it is and tried it it This is the huge barn-like dining hall with no decor except for ceiling fans. It's the size of several basketball courts. You can see an oven for roasting goose and other smaller items on the right. Next, there is a huge open kitchen.
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Post by douglaslam on Nov 6, 2016 18:34:25 GMT -5
Last night I ate out with two of my junior relatives. It was a very low key and inexpensive event. Here it is in pictures. My next post would probably be in Hong Kong as I am about to pack up for my bus trip in three hours. This is the place we went to. Tyuti1668 would certainly know where it is and tried it it This is the huge barn-like dining hall with no decor except for ceiling fans. It's the size of several basketball courts. You can see an oven for roasting goose and other smaller items on the right. Next, there is a huge open kitchen. This is the spread of food and a can of beer on the table. The total cost about A$20, even less for USD. I can live with that. On our way home, we pass the village square. This is what you can expect to see in every village; the scene of migrant women. and a few locals dancing. They are the 大媽 or Big Mamas. We are at a bus stop going home by public transport. Gina, this is for you; see the top row the marking in red, it is the bus stop for the Route 077 bus. Next to it to the left is Pong Tou your village in simplified characters. We are catching the 010 bus, not 077. Pon Tou is not out in the sticks. It is well served by public transport. One day when you get to China to visit it, the likely scenario is: Arriving in Guangzhou or Canton airport, then by Metro to Canton main railway station and bus interchange ( it's huge), then bus to Shiqi or Shekkie 石岐 our principal provincial centre, then by bus to Pong Tou. Of course you can hail a taxi, it is also very cheap. But I prefer to travel like a local. DJ, as I expected when I met LC the second time, he had something else for you. It was too late. It is only a DVD and a booklet, all in Chinese about lotus flowers. Not sure what to do with it. Never mind about the remittance, it is no big amount.
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Post by ginagaladriel on Nov 6, 2016 19:38:23 GMT -5
We are at a bus stop going home by public transport. Gina, this is for you; see the top row the marking in red, it is the bus stop for the Route 077 bus. Next to it to the left is Pong Tou your village in simplified characters. We are catching the 010 bus, not 077. Pon Tou is not out in the sticks. It is well served by public transport. One day when you get to China to visit it, the likely scenario is: Arriving in Guangzhou or Canton airport, then by Metro to Canton main railway station and bus interchange ( it's huge), then bus to Shiqi or Shekkie 石岐 our principal provincial centre, then by bus to Pong Tou. Of course you can hail a taxi, it is also very cheap. But I prefer to travel like a local. I see it!! I think traveling the "longer" way you get to see more scenery too, especially for when a person visits the first time. I, now more than ever, want to be able to visit the town of my ancestors. Thank you for sharing this! ♥
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