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Post by gingee on Apr 3, 2009 19:04:01 GMT -5
I'll be visiting relatives for the first time in April. What should I expect? What can I bring to relatives I've never met?
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Post by Henry on Apr 3, 2009 19:32:35 GMT -5
Hi Gingee,
Welcome to our Forum.
The Chinese custom is to never come visiting empty-handed. Bring some fruit, bakery items, or dim sum. Candies or cookies, or a little of each.
You should not expect anything. If your relatives are living in an ancestral village - they may not be able to afford to give you anything.
The best thing they can give you is a copy of the family clan genealogy book that has lineages that include your ancestors - ask them to mark your ancestor.
For gifts, I would bring along a bunch of the Chinese red envelopes that are usually given out around the Chinese New Year:
For very close family members, you can put in what you can afford. I do not know where you are from, but, a US dollar spends like a Chinese "yuan".
For blood relatives in a family, I give a $100 USD bill for the parent, with a $50 USD bill for each child. Then for close cousins, I give 100 yuan bill to each adult and a 50 yuan bill to each child. Then just have some red envelopes, each with a 20 yuan bill in each red envelope for each distance cousin and friends.
What the kids like is something from your country like a T shirt. Adults like some small gift or token of something from where you are from. Maybe a calendar, postcards, flag pins, etc.
Also, you should pay your respects to the ancestors at the cemetery - tell your relatives that you do not want to make it very elaborate - usually keep the food costs under $100 USD.
You may have to do a luncheon or dinner for the village relatives. A round table seating 10 -12 people runs anywhere from 400 - 500 yuan per table.
I hope this helps.
Henry
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Post by gingee on Apr 3, 2009 20:18:31 GMT -5
Henry,
Thanks so much for your response. Growing up in America and hearing so much about the relatives in the 'old country' will be very humbling to me. I have heard from others that visiting the home your parents left so long ago is very surreal. To see pictures of them and other relatives that left China still hung up on the wall is very moving. Your suggestions are greatly appreciated.
Gingee
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Post by raymond on Apr 4, 2009 0:43:43 GMT -5
Gingee,
I would like to add my small contribution to Henry's insightful comments about visits to the ancestral village. First, be sure you buy appropriate red envelopes......not the ones for weddings, birthdays or New Year.......I usually buy the ones for general occasions.
Secondly, the cost of materials to pay respect to the ancestors is very reasonable to me, about 400 RMB which is about $60 US......and that includes all the fixings for paying respect both at the ancestral home and the ancestral gravesite......a variety of food, firecrackers, ghost money, silver and gold leaflets, incense, wine, tangerines, apples, etc., etc. Also, at least in my village, the custom is for me to give a red envelope to each person attending the gravesite ceremony......a crisp 50 RMB note (about $7.50 US) is sufficient.
Finally, regarding what to bring for the relatives.......I bring individually-wrapped American chocolates (e.g., bite-size Milky Ways, Snickers, Dove's. etc.) which seem to be a delightful treat to the villagers, young and old alike.......to keep the chocolates from being crushed or melted in transit, I simply repackage them in tin or plastic canisters and put them in my check-in luggages. Another favorite thing to do is bring photos of the relatives as well as photos of sceneries and sights of wherever you live......they make for great conversation topics and icebreakers even when you do not quite understand everything being said.
Good luck,
Raymond
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Post by helen on Apr 4, 2009 1:10:11 GMT -5
Thanks for the words of advice. I too was wondering what I should be doing. Trouble is that I don't know who I will be seeing as I will be popping into the village unannounced. I figured I would need red envelopes. Should I be carrying my own joss sticks? ir can I expect there to be some in the shop - is there a shop?
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Post by Henry on Apr 4, 2009 5:23:13 GMT -5
Ginggee, We are most fortunate to have Ray's comments - he just returned from a trip to the homeland and also does a lot of local travel while there. He really does have his fingers on the the pulse of what is going on. It has been my experience that the village relatives are very happy to receive visits from their relatives from overseas, but, there are villagers are some with high expectations - which is why many overseas Chinese are reluctant to return to the village for a visit. Historically, Chinese sons went abroad to seek their fortune working overseas. Most sent money home, and many of the overseas Chinese did not return to China. They settled in foreign countries. Many continued to support those back in the villages, after the Communist takeover, many villagers fled to Hong Kong and lived off the remittances provided by overseas Chinese - some stayed in Hong Kong waiting for the US "green" cards that would allow them to join their relatives overseas. So, there is a long tradition of overseas Chinese sending money home to support family and relatives - some were expected to because these family and relatives pooled their money to send a person overseas. Most overseas Chinese immigrants led a very tough life in the "Gold Mountain" (US) or the new "Gold Mountain" (Australia) and worked so hard to feed their own families and still send money home. There was not any "gold" on the streets for them to scoop up. There are traces of an attitude that overseas relatives should support their village relatives - so do not be surprised that during your visit or soon after you return home - that your relatives in the villages talk about their need for money: to build some village gate, school or some other project, or that one or more of their children needs money for college, or it would be so nice if they could have something. They also want to come to the US under your sponsorship - as they did decades ago, but, is so hard to do now. I have provided my relatives with money, digital camera, computer, etc. Sometimes you feel bad because they have so little and you have so much - comparatively speaking. But, remember it was the very hard work of your immigrant parents that enabled your education and well being. One story I heard that I always remember is that an ABC returned and his village relatives told him to return to the US and take up a collection for a village school. He did and I believe he collected like $30,000 USD and sent it home - then, the relatives wanted to know how much money was going to be sent to the village on a monthly basis to support the school. When my friend told them that - this was all and that it was really hard to raise this money: the relatives instead of building a school the relatives took the money and opened a supermarket - thank you very much. So, my point is - be nice and kind, but not too naive. Henry PS - My impressions of my visit: siyigenealogy.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=shared&action=display&thread=287www.qimagazine.dailyqi.com/magazine/2008/tom.htmlPS - Helen, the villagers will provide the incense sticks along with the other food, etc, that Ray mentioned - usually, you are the one expected to pay for the cemetery visit. Do not be shy about limiting how much you want to spend. On my first trip to visit my ancestral village and paying our respects - my 2 sisters and I spent around $900 USD for about 75 people - just the whole roast pig cost over $160 USD, the other food, and red envelopes for those that attended the cemetery. We had also paid our respects at the ancestral home within the village also. |
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Post by gingee on Apr 4, 2009 11:12:43 GMT -5
Raymond,
Thank you for your suggestions; they are indeed appreciated. I thought bringing chocolates would be a good idea too, but I am so afraid they'll melt by the time we arrive in the village. I've already bought cookies and candy and have my envelopes ready. Now if I can get myself 'ready' for trip I would be in good shape. We are leaving next week and there's still much to do!
Thanks again,
Gingee
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Post by helen on Apr 4, 2009 14:54:45 GMT -5
Henry - I am only popping in for ine visit so I assume I will not get time to pay for the roast pig etc. I have had no "connection" with any one in any of the villages, bar my paternal Grandfather - so one would expect to just bring some red envelopes and N Z lollies? I have no idea what is going to happen or who to expect to help. Maybe I am being naive in my expectations that I will just be a tourist/photographer?
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Post by helen on Apr 4, 2009 14:55:39 GMT -5
Gingee - What villages are you travelling to? And how long has it taken to locate these new relatives?
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Post by raymond on Apr 4, 2009 17:44:31 GMT -5
Helen,
There is no such thing as "just popping in" for a casual look-see as if you are a tourist with no connections. Your coming to your paternal grandfather's village is indeed a Big Deal.....it means you represent your overseas lineage and you are "coming home" full circle to complete the sojourner cycle and to pay your respect to your ancestral village, and to acquaint and reconnect yourself wth any relatives who may still reside there. Here you are, standing on the very ground of your ancestors who were there way before you.......indeed of the same flesh and blood, one and all! This is something special, Helen......so very special.......take the time necessary to savor this hallmark occasion in proper perspective........
Raymond
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Post by helen on Apr 4, 2009 18:46:24 GMT -5
Hi Raymond - I know that I will be on my Grandfather's home ground - and that is special, as I have spent a long time in locating his sister's relatives. His sister remained in this village, taking over the house and land. Some one from this sister's family is taking me back there, so I could arrange everything from Guangchou. You're right - I just have to plan my visit with a bit more preparation.
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Post by gingee on Apr 4, 2009 18:48:02 GMT -5
Hi Helen,
I will be visiting Kwan On (Jun An) and Sun Shek Bei villages. My sister had gone for a visit a few years ago to Sun Shek Bei, which is where my father was from. My husband looked at the village roots section of this site, copied the characters and showed them to his relatives. We were told Kwan On or Jun An as it is called now, is where his Dad was born.
Gingee
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Post by douglaslam on Apr 4, 2009 23:46:21 GMT -5
Raymond puts it so well . There is no such thing as popping in for a look see, especially after you had established links. And remember, most of us are not young spring chickens, we are in the grandfatherly and grandmotherly generation, they people look to us for a little largess. Only people who are still in school or university, not making a living, or coming with their parents are not expected to show a little generosity.
On my first visit in 1973, and subsequent visits, I brought bicycle, sewing machine, wrist watch, transistor radio, electric fan, foodstuff, clothing and in the early 80s a colour TV for my mother. The list was endless. Overseas Chinese were a privileged class. Now, I only take money.
You can't afford to be too budget-minded, or people will talk behind your back. From the outset, I maintain I am a wage earner, a blue collar worker, no sugar daddy. Then they come not to expect too much. But I enjoy giving as much as those receiving. It is a tradition pioneered by our forebears. I always treat everyone close to the family to a dinner or two. It does not cost an arm or leg to entertain them in the village. Being simple people, they all show with children in tow. When the party is finished, they all take a doggy bag home. Nothing is left to waste. I love the village people for this.
Things are very different now. In the Mao era, it was very oppressive, everyone wanted to tell me his hard luck story, and dropping hints for help. I could not leave fast enough to return to HK.
Enjoy your trip. It is money well spent. Once you caught the bug, you want to go back again and again.
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Post by Ah Gin on Apr 5, 2009 0:01:59 GMT -5
Gingee, Helen et al,
Returning to one's roots is a joy understood by many but regrettably not easily available to some. By the tone of it, most if not all old hands from this Forum are happy for you. I am sure your trips will be very memorable and successful. You folks have already done a great deal of preparation to take a journey envied by many. I thought I will share my experience, in the hope that you might get something out of it.
Henry's wise counsel is worth following, as indeed Raymond's.
Philanthropy is a very personal thing. In general I think help in build up of infrastructure (school, roads, water storage, new toilets), rebuild of Memorial Hall) are worthwhile projects. I will not hesitate in offering help where I can. The balance and choice is entirely up to us all.
Having someone from the village to take you around, especially a relative makes it all the better. In my case, after the first visit, when I got to know our village well enough I chose to walk home to our village, once I got to the village edge. As I moved about the village, I felt I was going home, and I was. Although I was alone on the country road, from time to time, when I stopped to talk to the local farmers, I had a very warm response -- it was as if they knew I was heading home. It's a strange feeling, and I recommend all who could, to take this personal journey.
Whenever I got home, I like to spend time with my 80 plus year old aunt. She loved the attention and happy that her nephew is visiting her again. The stories she related to me helped me to further understand our family history. I usually give her a red packet, and I usually say"for Auntie to buy something for yourself" -- even though all her sons and daughters are well off and she does not need my small red packet, but that's not the point. It was my mark of respect to her.
Enjoy your journey.
Regards, Ah Gin
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Post by chansomvia on Apr 6, 2009 5:15:27 GMT -5
Hi Helen, As you may surmise the art of giving gifts to people in China can be a minefield as pointed out by responses from our regular forum experts. Each has had different experiences but as New Zealanders not used to tipping or handing out Red packets I share your uncertainty of what you should do. The simplest is to take the advise on this website. blog.yoyoor.com/yoyoor/entry/china_travel_tips_the_art which is an article on The Art Of Giving Gifts in China. There are many sides of the story, as Henry has pointed out the people in China perceived that the Gold Mountain people are loaded with gold nuggets. This makes it difficult for those who are the ordinary Chinese to hand out a month's earning to the outstretched palms during a brief visit. This perception has been made worse by the rich folks who come back to build grand buildings, erect monuments to perpetuate their wealth, throw grand feasts to flaunt their power, etc. If you are an ordinary bloke saving for years to make the trip back to see the village you may find it difficult to compete with the tycoons. Helen, I did the same as you are thinking off, I just popped in and looked around as there are no real connections with the people remaining in the village. The old have passed away or are senile, the young and enterprising have disappeared into the cities. I respect my ancestors but am not into burning offerings having lived overseas for so long and religious beliefs allows us to show respect in other ways. My daughter, who speaks and writes Chinese (Mandarin, Cantonese, Hakka, and Hokkien as most Malaysians) spent a month in China recently visiting the major tourist sites. She and her husband were taken around by her city cousins and Malaysian classmates living in China, there was no question of any embarrassing gift giving as most of them she was in contact with were professional and they made a point of paying for her and her husband. Not because my daughter was poor (they are both professionals) but as a matter of pride and courtesy. This is increasingly common, we are treated as guests, the same as when they come to our place. I am sure Henry knows of the Malaysian hospitality. Have a good trip, I hope my long posting does nor run counter to the general feeling of giving gifts to our Chinese family in China. Joe |
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