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Post by Steve Fong on Jan 13, 2011 12:49:45 GMT -5
After finding out more information this is my second post. I am in England UK and I am researching the ancestry of my grandfather. I have an elderly uncle from Canada who has supplied me with the images which show chinese characters. I am particularly interested in locating the village of his birth on a map and more about the family tree. Can someone please help me? The images show; 1.Grandfathers gravestone 2.Grandfathers name in Chinese characters 3.The place name of the village and area 4.Family tree-my grandfather is highlighted in red and my uncle tells me his name was Fong Nai-fong” (Married name), also known as Fong Sow. I am confused by this and what his born name was? The chinese family tree is particularly fascinating if I could make sense of it with names and dates etc. Unfortunately I have had to post images 2-4 below. Hoping someone can help Thanks in advance. Steve. Attachments:
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Post by Steve Fong on Jan 13, 2011 12:50:52 GMT -5
Image 2 Attachments:
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Post by Steve Fong on Jan 13, 2011 12:51:22 GMT -5
Image 3 Attachments:
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Post by Steve Fong on Jan 13, 2011 12:52:19 GMT -5
Image 4 Attachments:
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Post by Doug 周 on Jan 13, 2011 14:49:59 GMT -5
After finding out more information this is my second post. I am in England....Family tree-my grandfather is highlighted in red and my uncle tells me his name was Fong Nai-fong” (Married name), also known as Fong Sow. I am confused by this and what his born name was? The chinese family tree is particularly fascinating if I could make sense of it with names and dates etc. Steve, In answering your questions parsed out above: Look at this post Understanding Jiapu/Zupu for Chinese Illiterate. This introduction is in the middle of the post and has helped me understand reading the jiapu without a translator. After reading the wrongly placed introduction, go the the beginning of that thread. Someone else will have to help you with the village location. I assume your surname is Fong, though a more literate person will interpret the grave stone inscriptions and advise. Regarding the multiple names, this site is an erudite explanation: Chinese Personal Names<=clickCongratulations for progressing so far so quickly. Doug |
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Post by tyuti1668 on Jan 13, 2011 21:07:14 GMT -5
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Post by philiptancl on Jan 14, 2011 5:07:50 GMT -5
Hi Steve, To correctly view Chinese characters please select <View>, <Encoding>, and <Unicode> option from the browser menu. Congratulations. You have practically found whatever you set out to do and had done with great ease compared with most members in this Forum. Your surname being 鄺 (simplied Chinese é‚) (Kuà ng in Pinyin) and your grandfather’s name is 迺晃 (NÇŽi Huà ng in Pinyin). That would mean that he would be the 30th Generation (I suppose from your ancestor who first settled in Guangdong). From what you said Nai Huang would be your grandfather married name (i.e. å—). The reference provided by Doug could explain the various names for a person quoted in Chinese family tree at Re: Understanding Jiapu/Zupu for Chinese Illiterat « Reply #22 on Oct 24, 2010. Read more: siyigenealogy.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=names&action=display&thread=1266&page=2#ixzz1B0HNhlTrYour ancestral village is ç‰›è·¯æ‘ (Niú Lù CÅ«n) within a bigger region know as å››ä¹å¤§å¡˜ (49 Big Pond). If ç‰›è·¯æ‘ is also known as 常興 (or 常兴 or Changxing as stated by tyuti1668) then its location could be as shown in the Google map attached below. Also provided is a name of an institution associated with å››ä¹å¤§å¡˜. From the 4th image you had posted it the descendants of your ancestor 集ç (Jà LiÇŽn) (24th Generation) who settled in å››ä¹å¤§å¡˜ç‰›è·¯æ‘. The 4th image is page 149 of your zupu which much have being produced within the last 15 years. That page provides you with your pedigree line up to the 22nd generation. For pedigree line further up, it would be on page 147 on the same zupu. What you had shown is part of the family tree chart. If is much easier to trace your pedigree line using such family chart. Yours is especially easy as it provides the connection of the tree between pages. For details of each member within the chart you need to go to his individual profiles which could also be provided within the zupu. If you could get your uncle to provide you the complete zupu from which page 149 was extracted, I believe you should be able to trace up to at least the 1st Generation (i.e. your ancestor that first settled in Quangdong). It is also very likely it could provide your ancestry even further back. If you have any further problem or not able to track your pedigree line, do send me a personal message through this Forum.  Philip |
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Post by tyuti1668 on Jan 14, 2011 5:33:37 GMT -5
MAP #1 isn't the correct village MaP #2 shows the correct village |
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Post by philiptancl on Jan 14, 2011 9:22:35 GMT -5
Hi Tyuti1668, Thank you very much for the correction. Hope the revised map below shows the correction location:  Philip |
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Post by helen on Jan 14, 2011 21:25:15 GMT -5
Hi Steve, glad you could post the information. I'm in New Zealand, and don't read Chinese. Your fellow Taishan people can provide more information, if you need any more that the above. Good luck with your search. I hope you can make the trip soon.
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Post by Steve Fong on Jan 17, 2011 12:49:14 GMT -5
Thank you all so much for the help you have provided. My research is ongoing. Special mention to philiptancl who has provided maps and information. I will be in touch. Many thanks xxx
Steve.
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Post by Doug 周 on Jan 17, 2011 13:06:33 GMT -5
Steve, Glad the forum could help. We all learn from each other, and every family heritage journey is unique. Share where you are and what obstacles you are encountering. Being from the UK, you have a different perspective. Finally, if you have any links on UK Chinatowns, contribute them to the Wiki chinese.rootswiki.legacy1.net/doku.phpThe Wiki and the Forum both get input from all other the world, just that UK seems under-represented. Doug |
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Post by philiptancl on Feb 14, 2011 3:29:13 GMT -5
Steve Fong search for his ancestry is by one who has his zupu practically in his hand but one who is short of the basic skill in embarking upon his discovery; perhaps this is due the lack of knowledge in reading and understanding of written Chinese like me. Recently I received the scanned copy from the first 94 pages of the zupu from Steve who had received them from his uncle in Canada. (From the table of contentions, I think the whole zupu is about 560 pages). For those wishing to read the Chinese characters please select "View", "Encoding", "More" and "Unicode (UTF-8)". Steve's zupu is for Kuang/Fong (é‚) surname from the County of Taishan (å°å±±) and published in the year 1999. Based upon where his grandfather's name is located within the zupu, his ancestral village can be deduced as shown in the chart below.  What is also interesting is the adoption path of his surname from the originally Léi (é›·) surname to FÄng (æ–¹) surname and then to Kuà ng /Fong (é‚) surname. These three surnames collectively are commonly known as é¡æºå ‚ which in US has centers in Sacramento established in 1859 and in San Francisco in 1880. As the zupu the zupu that Steve Fong has is for the whole of Taishan (å°å±±), it does not contained information regarding about individual members as would be available in a jiapu (unlike that which Doug has). The zupu is similar to that which Ben Lee has for the Huang (黄) surname, also for Taishan (å°å±±). I would guess that details of Steve's branch should be available in the Datang (大塘) centre for the Local Kuà ng/Fong (é‚) surname. Philip |
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Post by Doug 周 on Feb 14, 2011 9:47:28 GMT -5
Philip, I thought Steve's image #4, reply #3~click had the linear family tree chart where he highlighted his close relative. ¿Were there not enough pages to delineate his heritage? Doug To correctly view Chinese characters please select <View>, <Encoding>, and <Unicode> option from the browser <Menu> |
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Post by philiptancl on Feb 16, 2011 0:15:55 GMT -5
Doug, Steve pedigree line heritage was the easiest to assist among new members of this Forum as he already have at hand the necessary information. Based upon the initial 4 sheets he had and emailed me and after a few questions on his current family relationship, he already established his pedigree lineage charted over 35 generations. Since Steve had agreed to share this with other readers of this Forum, I am posting the chart below. That itself is what I believed Steve was already very happy in his tracing his roots over to that extent.  For a non-Chinese out to trace his ancestry, what is revealed above would probably be beyond his wildest dreams but for a Chinese it is just the initial euphoria; probably just the start of the great adventure and thrill of researching into your roots. You would want to know the ancestry before the progenitor, how the surname originated and evolved, the historical migration paths that your ancestors took before you landed at where you are, etc, etc. You may also noticed that I was not able include the surname(s) of the wife(s) of his direct ancestors. It was for some of these reasons that I pushed Steve to get hold of a scan for the complete zupu, not just the four pages. Steve subsequently got the first 94 pages of the zupu. I had hoped his zupu would be similar to Doug’s zupu where details of individual members would also be provided. Alas it was not to be, judging from its table of contents. However that zupu on the Kuang/Fong surname for Taishan could not have being compiled in 1999 if materials had not been taken from jiapus from individual branches of that surname in Taishan. That is why I suggest to Steve that he might want to seek out the jiapu of his branch as well. They could be further wealth of information that might be gleamed from it. In the case my mother-in-law jiapu, I see the possessions of a few ancestors were even recorded! For Steve case, the 94 additional pages he subsequently obtained bring out a wealth of additional information; my posting at « Reply #12 » was one. Actually Steve did not have to come to this Forum for assistance to trace his ancestry if only he understands some semblance of Chinese. Fortunately for me, and other readers of this Forum (though Steve is gracious in attributing to the little help I might have rendered), we are all the richer by his presence to this Forum. Philip |
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