Stopovers in Canada and U.S. on way to Caribbean?

[christine]

Hi folks,

I am wondering if there is a way to learn about Chinese immigrants who passed through the U.S. or Canada on their way to further destinations, such as Latin America or the Caribbean?

I am on the trail of a Chinese dude who ended up in Trinidad, and I think I may have a lead on him entering Victoria, British Columbia, Canada, but then I can't find anything else about him. I've got his passenger list attached. He is "Ng, Yee Loy."

I have tried to search for his name on the site www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/chinese-immigrants/index-e.html which was a link from www.vpl.ca/ccg/General_Register.html#find, but I haven't come across anything even referencing this guy at all. I am trying to understand if registration of Chinese migrants in Canada was required or not depending on whether the migrant's final destination was Canada or elsewhere. I am thinking he did not need to register with Canada if he was just "passing through".

The digest of the passenger list is:
Name: Yee Loy Ng
Gender: Male
Age: 20
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1891
Date of Arrival: 22 Dec 1911
Vessel: Empress of Japan
Search Ship Database: View the 'Empress of Japan' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Port of Arrival: Victoria, British Columbia
Port of Departure: Yokohama, Japan
Roll: T-4865

From what I've gathered so far, the "Empress of Japan" did not go further east than the west cost of Canada, it was a trans-Pacific ship that did HK/China/Japan/Canada then back again. So how did Chinese migrants pausing on the west cost of North America make their ways further on, to places like Cuba or Trinidad? What boats/passenger lists could I look at to find these people? What was the route? I imagine this would have been a very long journey, as the list I have is for 1911, and the Panama Canal did not open until 1914. So did boats go all the way down the west coasts of North and South American, around the tip of South America, or was there an overland route and another boat ride from there to the islands, such as another boat from Canada to Panama, a short overland ride to the Atlantic Ocean/Caribbean Sea side, then back on a boat again?

If there is anything in Canada similar to the files we find in the National Archives of the U.S., how/where would I look for such? Do they exist for people just passing through?

I am a total novice at this area of Chinese migration routes/patterns, always learning.

Thanks,
christine

Attachments:

[christine]

Anyone?

[laohuaqiao]

My father has told me some Chinese arrived in New York or Boston by boat from Halifax, Nova Scotia.

The only clue on how they might have gotten to Halifax is during WW I, thousands of members of Chinese Labor Corps went to England and France by way of Empress of China to Vancouver, escorted on Trans-Canadian railroad to NS and trans-Atlantic boat from Newfoundland to Europe. After the War, the survivors returned the same way.

I suspect at one time transient Chinese travelers being escorted across Canada by rail might have been a common practice. But, I have not found any confirmation of this.

To answer your question, maybe there were boats from Halifax to the Caribbean.

[baksha]

Christine,
You are entering a specific field of study! I suggest you contact the National Archives in Canada,, the National Archives in Trinidad and Tobago, University of the West Indies to see what the archivists/ librarians recommend to study the shipping patterns.
Baksha

[chansomvia]

Christine has raised an interesting item on Stopovers on the American continent by Chinese migrants. I remember my late Uncle who said that he was indented as a worker for Cuba in the 1930's, he traveled from our village in Haiyen, boarded a ship I think from Hong Kong and sailed either to Los Angeles or San Francisco where he and the other Chinese workers were locked in a train carriage which took them to the nearest port to Cuba.

They were herded from the train carriage into a ship which took them to Cuba.

He worked for a few months in harsh conditions and caught a terrible tropical disease in Cuba and could not walk. The other overseas Chinese workers, which formed their own benevolent association, managed to collect enough money to send him back to China on a stretcher on the same terrible unhygeanic locked train carriage which took days for the coast to coast journey. I never managed to get the full story as he was essentially a country bumpkin and did not know any English, he therefore does not know the port of call as these indentured labourers depended on an agent.

He, as many of the enterprising Chinese, managed to survive this traumatic experience. This excellent forum has unearthed a lot of the suffering which our ancestors endured stoically, it is very important for those able to document these stories (persons such as Helen) to put them into print. I wondered about their documentations, travel papers, what they ate over the weeks on the ship and train, how they cleaned themselves and the toilet.

Joe

[helen]

Thanks for the reference Joe. I recorded some people who came over to NZ, as children. They recalled that their Mothers were stuck down below, in the cabins, sea sick all the way from China to Sydney. The kids remembered running around the boat with other children, and watching the rich people above the stairs, in their flash clothes, and dancing. The trips took weeks - One interviewee came on a cargo/passenger ship, and it took 6 weeks, stopping at various Islands along the way. So it would have been a nightmare for both the Mothers and the kids.

[christine]

Wow, what adventurous and difficult journeys these are. Joe, I feel so badly for your uncle, what an awful experience after a hopeful start. My grandmother did not enjoy her boat ride from Hong Kong either, lost too much weight and was very unhealthy for her first year or two in the States, but she finally got back her health after nearly dying in childbirth.
I will look further in to seeing what can be found for overland passage within the same country -- haven't run in to this before, only border crossings from one county to another. Unfortunately there is not much online for Trinidad archives, I think their archives are pretty old fashioned still. Also who knows what may even be there, since it was a British run place before so records could be in the UK for all we know.
This is good stuff. I will see what I can turn up! Is anyone on this board located in Vancouver or Canada in general? Can you tell me your experience with the Canada National Archives? In the U.S. National Archives, I generally will be able to show a passenger list to the archivist and they will be able to pull a file for me based on the particular page number and boat the list belongs to, and the line number of the passenger. Files were created for Chinese immigrants due to the Exclusion Act and so it has ironically become a gem of Chinese American researchers to find these ridiculous interrogations all written out. The best parts are the photos though I think. Anyway, if anyone has experience with Canadian Archives, can you share your experiences and the processes?
Thanks,
Christine

[baksha]

christine,
Back in 2006, this is an email I received from my contact in Canada on Chinese -Canadian Genealogy website re:www.vpl.ca/ccg/
(Vancouver Public Library)

" ... Phase 2 of the Chinese-Canadian Genealogy website, launched on May 31st. Phase 2 includes new pages on a wide range of topics, including citizenship and naturalization, church records, land records, wills and estates, and more. The â?oBack to Chinaâ?� section has been expanded to include more information about genealogical research and resources in China. In
addition, on the recommendation of our informal advisory group from the local Chinese-Canadian community, a new section on Chinese-American genealogy has been added. This reflects the a large volume of historical Chinese transmigration between the U.S. and Canada. The expanded site now also includes prototypes of finding aids for locating Chinese individuals in 1891 census records and 1911 ship passenger lists.

The launch of Phase 2 has proved to be very timely, as it has coincided with a surge of interest in the historical head tax records. The site includes information about the General Register, and information about other documents and records which may be helpful in pinpointing the date of an ancestor's arrival in Canada and locating them in the records. The site is at www.vpl.ca/ccg/

[helen]

I believe that Kenda Gee has a lot to do with the revived interest in the Poll Tax. He came to our bananas conference in New Zealand a few years ago. And recently there has been a documentary about the history of the Chines in Canada. Good on you all for rising up and beginning to record your collective history. New Zealand has received our Pardon a few years ago. www.lostyears.ca/

[amy]

Don't know if this is helpful, but on a voyage from China in 1922, my grandfather entered the U.S. at New York Harbor on a ship from Halifax. I found that ship's manifest on the Ellis Island website www.ellisisland.org/ (it's a free online search). I was curious to know further where the ship originated and how he got to Halifax so a few years ago while in Halifax, I stopped in at the Canadian Immigration Museum at Pier 21 www.pier21.ca/home. The librarians/researchers there looked up the ship name and informed me that grandfather's ship only commuted between Halifax and New York. They guessed that he most likely arrived on the western shore of Canada and took a land route to Halifax.

[christine]

Thanks to all for your great information!

I searched the Ellis Island records and found one entry that might be promising, however, when I go to read the original image of the manifest, it shows the wrong page and the wrong ship manifest entirely, I cannot for the life of me find the ship "Maracas."

This is the info, as they have it indexed:

First Name: Ng
Last Name: Yee
Ethnicity: China, Chinese
Last Place of Residence: Port of Spain, Trinidad, W.I.
Date of Arrival: Aug 08, 1910
Age at Arrival: 35y Gender: M Marital Status: S
Ship of Travel: Maracas
Port of Departure: Port of Spain, Trinidad
Manifest Line Number: 0019

Clicking on the image takes me to the larger size of it but the image is for the "Celtic" instead of "Maracas". Where did the Maracas manifests for 1910 go?

Here is the link: ellisisland.org/search/shipManifest.asp?MID=09517046450174451328&FNM=NG&LNM=YEE&PLNM=YEE&first_kind=1&last_kind=0&RF=2&pID=101403080220&

I realize this info varies wildly from the original image I posted, but since I have barely anything to go on, I will entertain both of these options. Alternately this could be a cousin or brother to the original, who knows.

Thanks!

[amy]

Hi Christine,

I just checked that listing and it appears they don't have the original manifests for the Maracas. See this link:
ellisisland.org/search/shipImage.asp?MID=09517046450174451328&FNM=NG&LNM=YEE&PLNM=YEE&first_kind=1&last_kind=0&RF=2&pID=101403080220&

However, that link does have a little more info on the ship and its history. There are a fair number of ship history buffs online and I have been able to find information just by searching the ship names. Hope this is helpful.

Amy

[christine]

Hi Amy,
I see that there is no image/photo of the ship, but there are manifests for the Maracas from many other dates here: www.ellisisland.org/search/ship_year.asp?letter=m&half=1&sname=Maracas
It just seems like the digital image for this particular date is not indexed right. I tried reversing it and looking up the Celtic, thinking maybe they were switched? But the Celtic comes up just right.
I think I may check Ancestry.com at the library to see if there anything different in their database.
Thanks!

[christine]

Update!
I contacted the helpdesk or whoever answers emails at Ellis Island and they fixed it, yay!
Now I will have to see if NARA NY created a file for this man when arrived in NY.