Amouk AMOU or AH MOOK or AH MOUK c1838 in Canton, China

[dfgrty]

Hello,

I am writing to this forum hoping to get some help in my quest for information about:

Amouk AMOU also known as John AH MOOK and possibly Charles AH MOOK, born in Canton (Guanzhou), Guangdong Province, China about 1838. He married Rose Ann O'CONNOR in 1867 in Rockhampton, Queensland, Australia. According to the Marriage register, his parents were John Abat AMOU (farmer) and Agal GIVAANE. He and Rose Ann O'CONNOR had 7 children in various places in northern Queensland, the four youngest were born in Charter's Towers. He worked as a miner and he died in Queensland.

I am interested in finding out anything about his family and their origins in China and when and how he arrived in Australia before his marriage in 1867 at age 29. 

Any research hints about Chinese genealogy that may progess my quest would also be very helpful. 

I would like to hear from anyone interested in exchanging information on this family.

Thank you.
Dale
Queensland, Australia

[geoff]

Hello Dale,

I found the following advert on page 3 of The Northern Miner (Charters Towers, Qld., 7 Oct 1877 newspaper. The original paper can be found on Trove online, trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper, search "Charles Ah Mook".


" To the Worshipful the Justice of the Peace

acting in and for the District of Charters Towers, in the colony of Queensland.

I CHARLES AH MOOK, now residing at the

St. Patrick Reef, do hereby give notice that

it is my intention to apply at the next Monthly Licensing Meeting, to be held at Millchester

on the 13th day of November next, for a Pub-

lican's General Licence for the sale of fermented and spirituous liquors in the house and appur- tenances thereunto belonging, known as the Canton Hotel situate on the St.Patrick reef, and which I intend to keep under the sign of the "Criterion Hotel." The house

contains two sitting

-rooms and six bedrooms, exclusive of those for the use of my family. I am married, and have

not held a licence before.

Given under my hand this 9th day of October, AD. 1877.

CHARLES AH MOOK."

[kerry]

Geoff,

It's pretty well impossible to directly connect the names you have to anyone or anywhere particularly in China. What you have is a courtesy name - essentially a nick name and not his formal family name which you could use to connect to a family or place. It's analogous to someone from China coming here and said they were looking for someone called "Bluey". Worse still, they're probably going to say "Brooee".

I've posted before on this subject - look for something written in Chinese. Graves whioh are inscribed in Chinese will usually have his name and the village he came from . Backs of photos should be checked for Chinese characters too. If he has submitted some official documents which are in state or national archives, try and get scans or extracts rather than transcripts. He may have signed his name "properly" in the margin.

[dfgrty]

Thanks Geoff,

The information in your post was very interesting and adds support that he used both names, John AH MOOK and Charles AH MOOK, apparently at the same time. In 1877, at the time of this ad he is recorded on the birth of one of his children as John. In the ad and on later registrations of the marriage and deaths of some of his children he is recorded as Charles.

I wonder if there is any way to find out whether he applied for and was granted the publican's license? I am trying to find out more information about the Canton Hotel in Charter's Towers and the history of that area at that time. His occupation was always recorded as digger or miner so there was no knowledge in the family of him being a publican. One of his granddaughters Lily PARR was living and working at the Australian Hotel in Mackay in 1936. My father-in-law said that AH MOOK was living with her later in his life but I have not been able to verify this so far. So it is not clear whether he died in Mackay or in Charter's Towers where his wife Rose Ann MOOK (nee O'CONNOR) died and was buried in 1916.

Other questions:
Where can I search to find out when and how he came to Australia?

How can I find out if he was naturalised?

Electoral rolls - who had the right to vote? Was it possible for someone who was not naturalised to be on an early electoral roll?

Thanks again for your information. It has opened up a new line of enquiry.
Dale

[dfgrty]

Thanks Kerry,

I will try and look for something in Chinese but as far as I know nothing exists. I still do not know where his grave is or whether any family members have any original photos. The scan of his marriage entry is only marked with a x. I am not aware of other official documents but would appreciate any guidance. I am not even sure to what extent he maintained his Chinese culture or connections given that he anglicised his name early on and the Chinese aspect of the family history was suppressed for such a long time and only really came to light as younger generations began to research their genealogy.

Dale

[kerry]

Publican's create a paper trail as part of the regulation of that business. Some of these might be OCR'd on Ancestry.com but if you're cheap like me (actually it's more that they just don't have enough stuff relevant to Chinese folks) go to a public library and use it there. I don't trust Ancestry's options on "alternate name spelling" for Chinese names. Just saying...

From the Record Search at NAA www.naa.gov.au/collection/search/ - in the Name Search tab, punch in the name. Check the
Immigration ..." category and the "Security and Intelligence" category.

If your deep into records in Queensland and aren't conveniently able to access archives there, I've used Judy Webster in the past. www.judywebster.com.au/

[geoff]

Hello Dale,

I searched Trove online for "J Ah Mook", "John Ah Mook",& "C Ah Mook" with nil results. There aren't anymore articles for "Charles Ah Mook".

Trying "Ah Mook" I found this notice....."LIST of Unclaimed Letters at the Post Office, Bockhampton ; if not claimed on or before May 14, 1883. will be for warded to the Dead Letter Office, Brisbane. EDWIN DA COSTA, Postmaster. P.O., Bockhampton, April 26, 1882. Ah Mook ;....", 5 May 1883, The Capricornian (Rockhampton, Qld) newspaper.

There are other results using "Ah Mook".....only you can tell if they are yours...have a look at Trove online...http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper.

Also, try the name of the hotel on Trove.

Where to find naturalisation docs?....
I found my maternal great grandfather's & paternal great great grandfather's naturalisation papers at National Archives of Australia (NAA) online. It gave his address, occupation, signature, where he took the oath in 1881. The applicant had to declare when & on what ship he'd arrived in Aust. Once you know the arrival port, date & ship's name, you can trace backwards the ports of call & estimate the date he departed from Hong Kong or China, from shipping arrivals & departures notices on Trove.

How to find arrival in Aust?....
At the NAA , also found his 1902 & 1907 Certificates of Exemption from Dictation Test, issued prior to departure from Aust & used to gain re-admittance to Aust from his trips back to China. On the application, he had to declare where he'd been residing & when....the answers took the family history back to the goldfields of Victoria....before moving to Sydney in 1883. And how did I know I'd "struck gold" with right documents? Aussie signatures on the 1881 naturalisation & applications for 1902 COD & 1907 CEDT all match. Also, the 1902 & 1907 addresses in Sydney are known to us.

On his Aust death cert there maybe an answer to "Time in Aust colonies?" (on NSW death regn it asked that question) if it was known & completed by the informant.

Regards,
Geoff

[kerry]

One of the problems with information on death certificates is that the only information that is reliable is stuff that the Informant actually knows. A few of the NSW and QLD DC's in my research have a number the "years in colony" that conflicts with other information - cases like a "number of years in colony" not equal to their age, but I also have a birth record showing they were born here.

I've also seen a DC where the informant left off several children from other marriages.

[andyjewell]

Hi Dale, I know this message is 2 years old but hoping you see it!

John/Charles Ah Mouk/Ah Mook is my 3rd Great Grandfather. I, myself don't have tons of information but i know my sister alot more. We also have some photos. How do you fit into the line? I am decendant from his daughter Ellen. 

regards,

Andrea

[dfgrty]

Hi Andrea,

I have only just seen your message.

Mu husband Peter is descended from his daughter Margaret. I would be very interested in communicating with you directly and sharing information.

I hope you get this message.

Dale

[lyn]

Hello Andrea,


I know this reply is a few years after your post and I hope you see this.  I am also a 3rd descendant from Amouk Amou (aka John (Charles) Ah Mook).  His Daughter Margaret was my GG Grandmother.  I am also looking for any information on him.  I have a copy of his marriage certificate, a photo of his grave marker in Charter Towers.  I also have some information on his other children and their descendants.


I live in Brisbane and would love to hear from you.  


Lyn