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Post by philiptancl on Sept 28, 2015 8:31:09 GMT -5
Hi Josh,
You need to narrow down to which county from Guangdong your Chin clan ancestry is from. Yongchun County where my clan (the same surname (陳) as your) of is only one of many counties within Fujian Province. Within Yongchun there are thirty 陳 clans listed the Yongchun Surname Clan Surnames Reference book. Of the 30, 26 of them have own set of generation names. Many of the 26 陳 clans have two sets as well. Ask descendants of others who had first settled at the same neighborhood as your great grandfather. Their ancestors might had come from the same place in Guangdong.
Philip
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rudy
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Post by rudy on Nov 30, 2015 11:34:01 GMT -5
Hi Uncle Philip, how are you? Been away for some times.My aunties has made a trip to Fujian last few months ago, brought my great grand father' funeral card with them. They believed that the upper head line of the card are containing our ancestoral village and it does!! The upper writings are pronounced as 'Shan-Yang-Se'..that is the name of a village in Amoy city in Fujian. They had already been to the village but unfortunately found no clues about the surname let alone any zupu.... By the way do you have any informations or idea about the Tan clan from this area? Its Shan-Yang village in Amoy city in Fujian province.. For your more information, I will post the google map of Shan Yang... Thank you very much for your helps Rudy
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Post by philiptancl on Nov 30, 2015 22:43:13 GMT -5
Hi Rudy,
It has been a while since I last heard from you. As there quite a few who are currently in contact with me regarding their ancestries in Fujian (福建), I needed to refresh my memory on your case through your past postings
I just sent your query to a distant relative now working in Fuzhou. His father descended from the same ancestor in Hushan (岵山) in Yongchun County (永春县) as me while his mother is descended from the same ancestor as that for my wife. He is a keen genealogist for my Chen/Tan Clan (陳氏) for Hushan (岵山). Hope he could use his contacts in Fujian (福建) to see if he could locate the jiapu/zupu for my Chen/Tan Clan (陳氏) in Shan Yang (山仰).
I am sending your search to another contact in Xiamen.
When your aunties made the trip there, did they try to locate the Chen/Tan Clan (陳氏) ancestral hall there in Shan Yang (山仰) and meet up with the committee?
I hope one of them could provide an answer to your search.
In the meantime, I hope you have recorded your family tree in Indonesia from whoever the ancestors you already know.
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rudy
Member
Posts: 8
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Post by rudy on Dec 1, 2015 10:58:02 GMT -5
Hi Uncle Philip,
Thank's for all your helps and efforts for me, yes my auntie were tried to locate our ancestor's village while they were in Fujian, firstly as the 'wild-stories' has suggested, they were thinking towards 'Qun-yao-chun' village situated on the same Xiamen city, but as soon as they got there, some people re-directing their way towards 'Shan-yang' in Haicang district also situated around Xiamen city, should this be based on the writes on my great grand father's 'funeral card' they had brought from here.
When they got there (Shan-yang) they had made any trips around the small town but failed to found any related ancestoral hall nor any contact persons of our clan...maybe language problems is one of the reasons to find the search in a very limited visiting time...
But so far we had already knows that our ancestor was coming from Shan-yang village and not from Qun-yao-chun as it told before...
Will gladly wait for any good enlightening news from your friends and relatives who did the search for me, please pass my honour and regards to them...
As the oldest son of the oldest son of the oldest son of my ancestor, I and my father has already making-up our so-called lineage book, but since the eldest person (Indonesian progenitor) is my great grand father so the value of the book is limited..
That's make me eagerly to get know more about the generations before him (in Penang) and finaly the Shan-yang progenitor of ours..
Thank you Uncle Philip, we've been so lucky to have person like you around..
Rudy
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Post by philiptancl on Dec 2, 2015 3:01:38 GMT -5
Hi Rudy, I had a response from my contact in Xiamen. She reminded me of another search for another Chen/Tan (陳) person in Malaysia we were assisting in February 2013 to locate his ancestral village also in ShanYang (山仰) ; Haicang District (海沧街道) ; Hai Teng (海澄縣) County ; Zhangzhou [漳 州] Prefecture (it's now in Xiamen Prefecture); Fujian Province [福 建 省]. My contact in Xiamen and the driver there (both were originally from Indonesia but must had returned to China during the turbulent times in Indonesia around 1965) took him to the ancestral hall in ShanYang (山仰). I understand there could be at least 2 ancestral halls for Tan clan in ShanYang (山仰). See images below for the ShanYang (山仰) signboard and one of the ancestral halls. This Tan (陳) friend could only find bits and pieces of the Tan genealogy as the zupu/jiapu was no longer available. From my observation in the past finding ancestral records along the coastal belt of Fujian seem not to be available. This was borne out by my Xiamen contact when she said that out of the 70 villages she encountered, she only managed to obtain four jiapus/zupus. Getting them in Anxi, Yongchun and Nan’an seem to be much easier. The Tan friend did manage to get the family history (21 pages) prepared on March 2009 by one Tan Thean Thor; 81 year old then from the Shan Yang Village. It is in Chinese and I forward that to you. I shall you a personal message regarding my email contact. This Tan friend ancestors originally must had settled in Taiping; not far from Penang. These are some of the details of his ancestors” “Great Great Grand Father & Great Great Grand Mother (paternal): Tan Or Seet & Gan Kheok Neoh ( born & died in China) Great Grand Father & Great Grand Mother (paternal): Tan Kang Or & Tan Chew Jeong Neoh (born in China & died in Padang Sumatra) Grand Father & Grand Mother: Tan Teong Hoo & Teoh Hum Seow (grandfather born in China & died in Taiping)” His chart I had assembled for him is given below: If you or anyone of your family members should want to visit ShanYang (山仰) again, I would suggest you could get into contact with my Xiamen contact and the driver. You then should not have any problem in communicating as my contact speaks Indonesia, Dutch, some English and of course Chinese. Below in the first episode of CCTV documentary where it featured another ex-Indonesia search for her Chinese roots with her Dutch husband. Towards the end she gave a speech in Dutch. The translator is my contact in Xiamen. When you refer to your grandfather' funeral card, would that be the document written out by the Taoist priest (in consultation with the family) for recitation during the funeral ceremony where it would contain the ancestral address in China as well as all the names of the mourners? In obituary published in Chinese newspaper, very often I see the ancestral address is also provided.
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rudy
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Post by rudy on Dec 2, 2015 13:30:32 GMT -5
Hi Uncle Philip, It's sounds like a great leaps on my search, yes the picture you've posted has had the same characters with my great-grand-father funeral's card... It's also interesting to me all about your Tan friend originated from Taiping you had mentioned about, mostly on his great grand father who had born in China but passed away in Padang Sumatra..it was said that my great-grand father's brother has lived and passed away in Padang too..are we share something in common? I wonder.. The generations name are not match, my great-grand-father was (Tan)-Soey-Hock, my grand father was (Tan)-Tjeng(Nowadays 'Ceng')-Bie and my father is Tan-Bwee-Eng, I myself never had any Chinese name as the family has the Indonsiazed Chinese surname; Sutanto... If they came from a close relatives link, I think the 'generations' name should match to ours..or they could be of the different generations or even the different clan at all... But this for sure a great achievement of mine that could only done by you and your friends helps, thank's for all.. Should any of us going back to Shan yang, I will tell you to get the best helps there.. I used to get online late at night after my medical practice hour, so that I'm very sorry to reply your post lately.. I'm already post my email address via the message box.. Once again thanks for all, may God bless you!! Rudy
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Post by philiptancl on Dec 6, 2015 9:52:03 GMT -5
Hi Rudy, I just found the following blog posting below regarding your ancestral place and the name of the progenitor (陈罗曹/陳羅曹). 羅曹 is the same as the chart I posted earlier. Note the clan members moving to Penang and those companies mentioned in Penang by some clan members. Go to the blog page and see the pictures posted. blog.sina.com.cn/s/blog_7493419a01015x80.html海沧山仰陈氏 山仰頴川衍派属太傅派,开基先祖陈罗曹,明朝末年迁移而来。至今已有4百多年,先后裔孙800多人 先祖生三子,大房居北市,二房居山仰,三房居海门岛(今龙海海澄)。山仰裔孙分五大房。山仰在清朝原属漳州龙溪海澄三都,后山仰有大量移民至马来西亚新加等,并且在槟城安居建有颖川堂陈公司与新安邱公司,霞阳杨公司、石塘谢公司锦里林公司齐名。 先今山仰所处地位实属尴尬。没有知名度、没有能领导这个村社发展的人,都是各自为营。 山仰标志建筑有陈氏家庙、頴山堂 供奉着广泽尊王
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rudy
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Post by rudy on Dec 7, 2015 11:21:08 GMT -5
Hi Uncle Philip,
Will go and see the blog right now, am really appreciate that...
But..what is the meaning of those Chinese writings below? I'll copy and try to translate them within your last email attachement..
Thanks for all,
Rudy
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Post by philiptancl on Apr 15, 2016 8:48:54 GMT -5
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Post by zenyatta on May 31, 2016 15:49:22 GMT -5
Thank you, Philip, for your contribution. All I know about my family is that my grandfather is from Nan An, and his name is Tan Tiong Tick. If you have any information, that would be much appreciated.
Patti Tan
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Post by philiptancl on Jun 7, 2016 23:33:27 GMT -5
Hi Patti,
Sorry for the late reply as I was busy doing other works on genealogy and did not check the Forum for a couple of weeks.
You need more information than what you currently have if you wish to trace your ancestry and your ancestral village in Nan’an (南安). You need also to know your grandfather’s name in Chinese characters. Knowing that your ancestry is from Nan’an, your surname would be the same as mine.
The following are potential sources of getting some or all these information required for your search.
1. The gravestones of your ancestors or your Tan relatives (however distant) who had passed away. They could record the ancestral place beyond just Nan’an.
2. Old letters that your ancestors or any of your Tan relatives (however distant) had corresponded with counterparts in China.
3. Old documents left by any of your Tan relatives. Sometime ancestors may write down ancestral details (in Chinese) to pass on for future generations but very often descendants think they are worthless pieces of papers and would discard them. Just in 2014, a friend (who is the 5th generation here in Malaysia) showed me a piece of paper his great grandfather left behind. In it was written the ancestral details (including the ancestral hall they belonged to) and the ancestral village his family originated from. With the information provided, he took his parents and a cousin to seek out his roots. He not only met up with his distant relatives but brought back their recently updated ancestral records that included the name of his great grandfather. I have done his pedigree chart now and it went up to Zhou Wen Wang of the Zhou Dynasty.
4. Talk to your Tan relatives (however distant) as they may know some of these information.
5. If you or your Tan relatives still have ancestral tablets/photos for veneration during anniversary of their deaths, there may be information written on them or genealogy information concealed within compartments in the ancestral tablets.
6. Where your ancestor first settled overseas? Sometimes people from the same ancestral village in China would go to the same foreign place initially. I am of the third generation in Malaysia and I could count at least 10 other people (not necessary of the same surname) who first came to the same place in Malaysia where my grandfather had settled and where I was raised.
Where are you residing now?
Philip Tan
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Post by philiptancl on Jun 13, 2016 6:48:58 GMT -5
This is the first draft of Scroll 4 for the descendants of Fujian, Yongchun, Hushan Nan Chen (Tan) Clan Association of Selangor (雪兰莪福建永春岵山南陈家族会) showing how some of the descendants of You Dao Gong (優道公) in Malaysia are related. This scroll is to be printed for presentation to the Association in its coming annual dinner in October 2016 and for bringing back to the main ancestral hall (永春小岵南山陳氏宗祠) in Hushan for the coming annual clan gathering during Winter Solstice in December 21, 2016.
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Post by charliechen on Aug 31, 2016 1:27:42 GMT -5
Hi Phil
You seem to know a lot about Chen last name. My grandfather moved to Taiwan during the war and he died when my father was five years old. So there isn't much that my dad knows about lineage of his last name. He was able to find out more through my grandma and actually went to visit my grandfather village in China. Their village was in funan, Fu yang, an Hui China But that's as far as he got in terms of finding out more about his family. I was wondering if you know anyone or where my Chen clan came from as I see most were from fu Jian not an Hui China. If you have any info pls send my way. Thanks in advance
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Post by philiptancl on Sept 16, 2016 17:18:55 GMT -5
Hi Charliechen,
I suppose your ancestral village is in Funan County (阜南縣), Fuyang Prefecture (阜陽市), Anhui Province (安徽省). So far I have not have any opportunity to look at Chen (陳) originating from there. From what you said, I suppose your father would be younger than me. Since he had visited your grandfather village in China, he should know the name of the ancestral village in Funan County (阜南縣). It would then be a question whether there is still a copy of your Chen Clan (陳氏) Jiapu (家譜) or Zupu (族譜) still existing there. If you are unable to go there personally to search for it yourself, I could recommend you the service of someone who can do that for you.
The chart you see I had posted above on June 13, 2016, I have recently updated to include more people within it. I shall post it in the near future. One of people within it is from Taiwan.
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Post by sgdescendant on Sept 20, 2016 5:52:55 GMT -5
Hi Uncle Phillip,
I was reading your posts and is amazing how you've managed to compile all these charts together. Though my surname is not Tan, but my great grand mother is descended from the Tan side.
You mentioned there are 90 progenitors of the Tan surname and 1 of which is from Jinmen (kinmen, 金门). My great grand mother's father though born in Xiamen but is of the Jinmen Tan descendancy. His gravestone wrote "金门, 西園" (Jinmen, Xiyuan). I've checked online, Xiyuan is indeed in Jinsha, Jinmen.
Do you have the chart for Jinmen Tan?
Thanks!
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