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Post by philiptancl on Aug 28, 2014 2:12:13 GMT -5
Lachinatown,
I believe Henry's brother-in-law is still in New York.
In California, George Chin has a set but it is not of the quality when using anti-UV ink on artist canvass. He got the set from me when he visited me some years ago while he and his wife were Kuala Lumpur. KC Tan, in California, has his pedigree chart using anti-UV ink on artist canvass. Fay Chee has many, many sets (20+) for her Szeto surname. Probably they are scattered all over US and Canada.
Philip
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Post by sierratrout on Aug 28, 2014 13:50:03 GMT -5
I'm speechless! Thank you Ken, Philip, laohuaqiao, Doug and lachinatown. Within the last 24 hours you were able to confirm my grandfather's village, send me the complete Chen pedigree chart, and merge my geni.com account with my Chen ancestors! Four years ago I posted just a handful of queries on this board, and in the interim you managed to piece it all together while I sat back, pretty convinced that I had reached a dead end. You didn't even disown me for not knowing who Huang Di was! I appreciate your intellect, tenacity, keen memory, and willingness to help others. Most of all, thank you for recharging my battery.
I've been on vacation this week which allowed me more time to sort through this material and to plan my future Chen research projects. Beginning next week, you may not hear from me as often (my work is very consuming) but I'll do the best I can to stay in touch. I have a lot more questions, and would also like to share what I've learned to date.
THANK YOU! YOU'RE AWESOME!
--Deborah Trout
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Post by Doug 周 on Aug 29, 2014 9:14:51 GMT -5
Deborah, In 2010, when you posted your initial threads, one could recognize you had done a significant amount of research and had reached a brick wall. The Chinese Forum moderators are even more helpful when inquiring genealogists share their material leading up to their impasse. While involved in an Oakland CA Chinese genealogy conference, CA, you introduced yourself as sierratrout, giving me access to your email address via the enrollment list. However, as kjhong wrote, it was especially laohuaqiao who continued to keep your concerns active in his unsolved file. After contacting you about a possible research finding in 2012, it took another 2 years (2014), when Ken shared his own research, that he and laohuaqiao made the most important connection. Serendipity happens to those prepared.
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Post by sierratrout on Aug 29, 2014 10:41:58 GMT -5
Doug,
Thank you for your response. I think of myself as a very poor researcher, easily intimidated by Chinese characters and relying on good people to lead the way. I did see the 2012 post by laohuaqiao directing me to Hanson Chan, but wasn't prepared at the time to make the leap. I am grateful that laohuaqiao keeps a thick file and remembered my unusual findings. When Ken posted, I realized I couldn't let this opportunity slip away again. On a more personal note, we lost our first-born son in 2010 at the age of 18, and my focus has not been the same since. I think I'm better now.
Well, I have a lot to material to review, so I'd better get at it. Thanks again!
Deborah
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Post by lachinatown on Aug 29, 2014 11:12:17 GMT -5
Sorry to hear about your loss, Deborah. Best to you and your family.
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kjhong
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Posts: 87
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Post by kjhong on Aug 29, 2014 13:54:23 GMT -5
After talking to my mother and two of my aunts who all grew up in Oakland Chinatown, it turns out the my older aunt knew Deborah's family and considered them to be close cousins. She called Deborah's grandmother "Yuern Som" in Toisanese. My other aunt remembered the family but didn't seem to know of our relationship. My mother who is the youngest daughter in her family only remembered a Walter Chinn who was the principal at her elementary school and probably isn't related (at least to this part of the family).
Lessions Learned: - Interview as many of your elders as possible. They all have different memories and recollections. This is something I need to do more, but with three young boys to look after, it's much easier to sit at my computer, translating old documents, doing Google searches, and lurking around forums. =)
- If someone has the same or similar last name as your parents, ask them where they're from. You might be related, and more closely that you would have thought.
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Post by sierratrout on Aug 29, 2014 21:30:00 GMT -5
"After talking to my mother and two of my aunts who all grew up in Oakland Chinatown, it turns out the my older aunt knew Deborah's family and considered them to be close cousins. She called Deborah's grandmother "Yuern Som" in Toisanese."
Hi Ken,
Do you have any idea what "Yuern Som" means? Is it a term of endearment? As I remember, my grandma was referred to as "Bow Yet Lum" on legal documents; and "Fannie Chinn" by those close to her.
Did your mom or aunties happen to mention Yuey Chinn, my grandfather? From my research I've learned he was a very "colorful" person, and I am curious to know what the word on the street was back then.
I'm still trying to become fluent on "geni.com". Please bear with me!
Take care, Deborah
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kjhong
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Posts: 87
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Post by kjhong on Aug 30, 2014 11:23:54 GMT -5
I sent a email to my Aunt to see if she remembers "Yuey Chinn" and what "Yeurn som" means. So, tbd.
My mom and her closest sister were born in the late 1930's after Yuey Chinn's time, but this Aunty did know that we were related and she played Mahjong with Aunt Luella often, up to two days before she passed away. My youngest Uncle (born in the 1940's) knows some of your cousins as well. Somehow, my Mom doesn't remember the "Chinn" branch of the family, but she's moved away from Oakland after she got married and wasn't a social butterfly like some of her siblings.
If you need any help with Geni, let me know.
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Post by sierratrout on Aug 30, 2014 13:02:09 GMT -5
Ken, Oh my gosh! I played mahjong with Auntie Luella, her daughter Janice, and another person whom I can't remember, three days before she passed (Luella won -- she was awesome at mahjong). I became interested in Chinn family history in 2009 when I realized that my mom and Luella were the only remaining children of Yuey's. I first interviewed Luella in August, 2009, and she proved to be an excellent historian. I had just found out she was terminally ill, and I hadn't seen her for more than 20 years (much of the Chinn family had spread apart, but that's another story), but she remembered me and was delighted that someone wanted to hear her story. She is actually one of the Chinese women featured in a book, "Remaking Chinese America: Immigration, Family, and Community, 1940-1965" by Xiaojian Zhao. Amongst other things, she was a riveter at the Alameda Naval Air Base during WWII. During that first interview she and her daughter Janice tried to teach me mahjong, one of Luella's favorite pasttimes. It was a disaster for me although they accepted it in good humor. At the time I didn't realize she would be gone in a month, so in my usual gun-ho style, I went home, bought a set of mahjong tiles and an instruction book, enlisted somewhat willing players, and set out to become a mahjong player whom at the least didn't hold up the game. My next visit to see Auntie was September 27, 2009, three days before her death. I happened to be in the Bay Area interviewing a long-time friend of my mom's, and thought I'd drop by. She seemed a little more tired but still welcomed my questions, truly appreciating the memories. We ended our visit with a game or two of mahjong. I wish I could say I was not a hindrance, despite my practice on the side-lines, but I was. How can people think and move tiles so fast! I was astonished to learn that she passed three days later, but grateful that I had a chance to capture her beauty and grace before she died.
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kjhong
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Posts: 87
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Post by kjhong on Aug 30, 2014 15:50:15 GMT -5
What a great set of photos! Your aunt was beautiful. I can see that it runs in the family. =)
My aunt did get back regarding the term "Yuern Som". She meant "Yuey Som". (som means younger aunt in Chinese meaning the wife of a younger son, an older son's wife would be be addressed as Moh.)
The Chinese character that she's using for younger brother's wife is probably (嬸: Mandarin: shěn; Cantonese: sám).
I'm not sure about the word she uses for older brother's wife. The terms I've seen in Mandarin include: - 伯母 (bó mǔ) eldest brother's wife (the second character from this word is probably the one used by my Aunt to refer to female elder) - 大媽 (dá mā) eldest brother's wife - 大娘 (dà niáng) older brother's wife It might be different in Cantonese or See Yip.
She never met Yuey Chinn, but knew and met your grandmother [probably before my Aunt and Uncle married].
See my private message on Geni for more details.
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Post by blackwolf on Dec 20, 2014 11:27:07 GMT -5
I also am from the Chin family, out of Taishan, Canton area. My father Chin Koong Lai (Monty), he and his 2 brothers came over about the same time as your family, through Canada, ending up in San Francisco, Ca. Moving to Monterey, Ca owning a restraint, Bamboo Gardens I am told that the information may not be correct, but it is all we have to go by. My father Chin Gon Ark (Harry) was a bartender for many years in Chinatown, San Francisco, Forbeddin City, around 1930's. My search I hope will help with health issues. My Grandmother, only name I have is Chin Ng Shee, from the village across the river from the Chin Village. I am seventy, so I am going back a few years. Any help would be appreciated of my family both in San Francisco, Ca and China would be great. Oh, my grandmother died at 49 of TB in San Jose, California, bones shipped back to China, were I don't know. We think she died around 1920's.
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Post by blackwolf on Dec 20, 2014 11:58:09 GMT -5
Looking for information about Chin Koong Lai, my grandfather and maiden name Ng Shee, my grandmother. 1823 Chin family moved Sacramento St, San Francisco. July 7th Chin Tung Sue was born. (this is taken from Chinese notes) 1827. I found the name of a school in the village where my family lived before coming to US. China, DOW SHAN LIN CHOW SCHOOL, TAISHIN, DOW SHAN, CANTON, PEOPLE REPOBLIC OF CHINA. 1827 Chin family moved to San An Mok St 1829, Chin family moved back to San Francisco and stayed on Baily St. (Broadway?) If anyone knows this story in San Francisco, I know it was a long time ago, so no one is still alive, but maybe someone can help. thank you
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Post by lachinatown on Dec 20, 2014 13:47:21 GMT -5
Have you looked into federal records?
Do you have any Chinese characters?
Is TAISHIN = Taishan 台山
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Post by blackwolf on Dec 24, 2014 23:03:06 GMT -5
Yes, How do I transfer the characters to Chinese Genealogy? I have a printer, Kodak ESP C315, I think I can transfer like a fax over to you. I have the family history in Chinese characters, and the address of the school also in Chinese characters. I also noticed the dates on my messages may not be correct. I am so grateful that this form is here, and you and others are so devoted in Chinese Genealogy and are willing to help us. I was told that the birth information of in aunts and uncles may not be correct. Do you remember Frank Chin, my uncle, he was blind, had a candy and newspaper stand in Chinatown, San Francisco, Ca. After reading Dorothy's family history I don't think we are related.
Thank you, Diane Yue Lon Chin, Eisenhardt
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Post by lachinatown on Dec 25, 2014 12:46:04 GMT -5
Best way is to post a photo. Maybe Doug 周 could help you with posting.
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