|
Post by Henry on Oct 27, 2015 9:10:10 GMT -5
|
|
|
Post by philiptancl on Oct 27, 2015 9:10:26 GMT -5
Hi Marlee,
I am not clear of the exact relations between the people you had mentioned in the postings.
Firstly, you have your great grandfather LEE CAM, the name later changed to LEY CAM. I suppose he would be your paternal great grandfather. He married your Mexican great grandmother (Leticia Apodaca) who would be your paternal great grandmother.
Secondly, when you mentioned your grandmother, I suppose she is your paternal grandmother who would be the daughter-in-law of Lee Cam and would your father’s mother. When you mentioned about your “grandma's brother”, do you mean your “grandma’s brother-in-law”; i.e. your grandpa’s brother? Otherwise his “Father” would not be quoted as LEY CAM.
Thirdly, when you mentioned that your “grandma mentioned several times that his father had already a wife and kids in Canton”, do you mean LEY CAM is the one already had a wife and kids in Canton. This was very common during that period. I know of many such cases.
I would venture a guess that LEE or LEY would be the surname written in Chinese character to be李. That character would be normally be Romanized as LEE using the Min nan dialect (Southern Fujian) and would sound much like LEY when spoken by Cantonese in Malaysia.
There would be other Chinese in the same locality where LEE CAM first settled in Mexico. It is very likely that many of them would have come from the same ancestral place as that of your great grandfather. See whether you can locate some of their descendants who might know the name of the ancestral place in Canton.
|
|
|
Post by Henry on Oct 27, 2015 10:13:26 GMT -5
Dear Marlee, As my dear friend & colleague, Philip Tan, has indicated. Your Chinese family surname is probably Lee [ 李 ]. Please go to this link which includes a listing of Chinese organizations in the Chinatown in Mexicali: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinatown,_Mexicali The Lee clan is include as one of the 4 clans covered by this Chinese surnames association: Asociación Lon Sai (隴西公所): Membership based on surnames Kuan, Pan, Lee, Chu. If you are unable to locate the contact inormation for the Lon Sai Association - I suggest you contact the Asociación China de Mexicali (中華會館)[ www.asocchinamxl.com/menuchino.html ]: and they can probably provide you with that information. Henry
|
|
|
Post by amy on Oct 27, 2015 13:14:08 GMT -5
For historical background and context, the book "Alien Nation: Chinese Migration in the Americas from the Coolie Era through WWII" by Elliott Young has extensive information on the Chinese immigration to Mexico. If you contact that author, he may also have some leads or contacts for you from his research.
|
|
|
Post by douglaslam on Oct 27, 2015 19:47:37 GMT -5
Dear Marlee, my immediate neighbouring village is a Lee village, and there are many Lee villages about. It would be no trouble at all for me to call if I had his name or his siblings or father's name, or an old photo. Do you have any photo of your great-grandfather's family in China? I did think of Don Ley Fong, and get a printout to jot people's memory. I think it was common in your ggrandfather's day for close relatives or clan members to travel together for mutual support and comfort. Where does the Fong bit come in. If he was a cousin bearing the family name Fong, there is also a Fong village close by. The photo would be a great help.
Time is fastly running out before I fly out of China on 4 Nov. I plan to spend a couple of nights in Canton to visit an aunt and cousins, that is a time constraint. If you can wait, and clues point to your ggrandfather was from Chungshan, there is always next year. I might even be able to send my spies to do the job in my absence.
Let me sidetrack a bit; I have cousins ( they are Lees ) in the USA who are also Spanish literate. They were refugees from Castro's Cuba back in the 1960s. I am presenting them with a photoshop retouched old photo of their mother, the only known photo of their mother as a child, with her older two brothers and parents taken in the late 1920s. It meant so much to them. I also took photos where (a photo studio) that photo might have taken. There is also the site where a theatre used to be, and where their father first laid eye on my auntie, and was besotted. Their father returned to China for a visit from Havana soon after the end of World War Two and ended up marrying my auntie.
One of my cousins wanted to travel with me this year to China. Because I was tied to the group of Australians, it could not go ahead. I am spliting my leave in two batches next year, I may come to China in Oct. again, with my cousin and wife. There would be time for your search if you could wait.
Let's hope your ggrandfather was from Chungshan, which I also called home.
Douglas
|
|
|
Post by marlee on Oct 28, 2015 19:07:57 GMT -5
Dear Philip My Grandma is from my maternal side. So my grandmother is my mother's mother. And the brother of my grandmother is my mother's uncle. I hope that make sense. Thanks for the insight! For me all the information is kind of new. no one in the family was interested at all to find out more and now that I'm looking for it no one has answered. It is a shame they never tried to trace this information Regards, Hi Marlee, I am not clear of the exact relations between the people you had mentioned in the postings. Firstly, you have your great grandfather LEE CAM, the name later changed to LEY CAM. I suppose he would be your paternal great grandfather. He married your Mexican great grandmother (Leticia Apodaca) who would be your paternal great grandmother. Secondly, when you mentioned your grandmother, I suppose she is your paternal grandmother who would be the daughter-in-law of Lee Cam and would your father’s mother. When you mentioned about your “grandma's brother”, do you mean your “grandma’s brother-in-law”; i.e. your grandpa’s brother? Otherwise his “Father” would not be quoted as LEY CAM. Thirdly, when you mentioned that your “grandma mentioned several times that his father had already a wife and kids in Canton”, do you mean LEY CAM is the one already had a wife and kids in Canton. This was very common during that period. I know of many such cases. I would venture a guess that LEE or LEY would be the surname written in Chinese character to be李. That character would be normally be Romanized as LEE using the Min nan dialect (Southern Fujian) and would sound much like LEY when spoken by Cantonese in Malaysia. There would be other Chinese in the same locality where LEE CAM first settled in Mexico. It is very likely that many of them would have come from the same ancestral place as that of your great grandfather. See whether you can locate some of their descendants who might know the name of the ancestral place in Canton.
|
|
|
Post by marlee on Oct 28, 2015 19:19:13 GMT -5
Hi Douglas Thank you so much for your support! I'm happy to see there at least chance to be able to track some information even if it may take time. I'm ok with as we have barely no information. The only pic of my great grand father is this one. In this picture he is with his Mexican Wife (Leticia Apodaca) and kids. If the picture is not big enough I can always send it to you my email or private message. There may be another picture of him that I'm trying to track but is not only until Friday or Saturday they would be able to send it to me. It is a bit complicated having to trace all this from New Zealand. I'm sure he was from Canton as that is stated in one of the Birth Certificates of my grandma's brother. I have no other information detail. I just know there are other people in the country with the same name (LEE) somehow my grandma told me (when she was able to talk) that there were some relationship between them. So I belive that Don Ley Fong may take us to more information. Thank you so much for your help, honestly I appreciate it. It doesn't matter how much time it takes I'm happy at least doing something about it. Dear Marlee, my immediate neighbouring village is a Lee village, and there are many Lee villages about. It would be no trouble at all for me to call if I had his name or his siblings or father's name, or an old photo. Do you have any photo of your great-grandfather's family in China? I did think of Don Ley Fong, and get a printout to jot people's memory. I think it was common in your ggrandfather's day for close relatives or clan members to travel together for mutual support and comfort. Where does the Fong bit come in. If he was a cousin bearing the family name Fong, there is also a Fong village close by. The photo would be a great help. Time is fastly running out before I fly out of China on 4 Nov. I plan to spend a couple of nights in Canton to visit an aunt and cousins, that is a time constraint. If you can wait, and clues point to your ggrandfather was from Chungshan, there is always next year. I might even be able to send my spies to do the job in my absence. Let me sidetrack a bit; I have cousins ( they are Lees ) in the USA who are also Spanish literate. They were refugees from Castro's Cuba back in the 1960s. I am presenting them with a photoshop retouched old photo of their mother, the only known photo of their mother as a child, with her older two brothers and parents taken in the late 1920s. It meant so much to them. I also took photos where (a photo studio) that photo might have taken. There is also the site where a theatre used to be, and where their father first laid eye on my auntie, and was besotted. Their father returned to China for a visit from Havana soon after the end of World War Two and ended up marrying my auntie. One of my cousins wanted to travel with me this year to China. Because I was tied to the group of Australians, it could not go ahead. I am spliting my leave in two batches next year, I may come to China in Oct. again, with my cousin and wife. There would be time for your search if you could wait. Let's hope your ggrandfather was from Chungshan, which I also called home. Douglas Attachments:
|
|
|
Post by marlee on Oct 28, 2015 19:31:58 GMT -5
Hi Henry I have attempted to send an email to the address in the website asocchina@prodigy.net.mx. The email has bounced back. I have left a message in the website tho. There is few information in Spanish there except for the address which I'm not able to visit as I'm not based in Mexico (I'm in New Zealand) My sister was trying to call today to find out more. They have more information in Chinese but unfortunately I don't speak any Chinese I will try tonight with the associations that are on en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinatown,_Mexicali Thank you so much for your great tips Henry!! Dear Marlee, As my dear friend & colleague, Philip Tan, has indicated. Your Chinese family surname is probably Lee [ 李 ]. Please go to this link which includes a listing of Chinese organizations in the Chinatown in Mexicali: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinatown,_Mexicali The Lee clan is include as one of the 4 clans covered by this Chinese surnames association: Asociación Lon Sai (隴西公所): Membership based on surnames Kuan, Pan, Lee, Chu. If you are unable to locate the contact inormation for the Lon Sai Association - I suggest you contact the Asociación China de Mexicali (中華會館)[ www.asocchinamxl.com/menuchino.html ]: and they can probably provide you with that information. Henry
|
|
|
Post by Henry on Oct 28, 2015 22:12:00 GMT -5
Hi Marlee,
You may want to try some of these other telephone numbers - I believe anyone of these organizations could probably provide you with up to date information:
Several Chinese Mexican community organizations near Mexicali
1 Asociación China de Mexicali Avenida Juárez 120, Zona Centro, Mexicali, B.C. 21100 +52 (686) 552-4651
2 Asociación Chung Shan Avenida Juárez 132, Zona Centro, Mexicali, B.C. 21100 +52 (686) 552-9705
3 First Chinese Baptist Church 702 Encinas Avenue, Calexico, CA 92231 +1 (760) 357-6333
4 Iglesia Bautista Bethel Calle "A" 161, Segunda Sección, Mexicali, B.C. 21100 +52 (686) 554-2166
5 Mexicali Baptist Mission Condominios Monte Albán 408, Calz. de los Presidentes, Zona Centro, Mexicali, B.C. 21100
Henry
|
|
|
Post by douglaslam on Oct 29, 2015 0:50:10 GMT -5
Dear Marlee, I am going to give you a progressive report just to keep your spirit up. Yesterday I had a yum cha lunch with some older folks. One an 86 years old returnee from Sydney, who is a Wong from member andrewAU's village. I know him and his other two brothers in Sydney well. The Wong fella has a sister, who at 84 years of age is married to a Lee villager, an old man now at 95 years of age. Though the old man did not join us, but I learned he still has all his marbles. He certainly would not know your g-grandfather even if they were both from the same village. But he may know someone with a likeness to him. There are two villages with the Lee name in my neighbourhood. I have now the two photos on my USB stick, I'll get a printout and get my village brother to take me to the villages. If possible, I'll call on the 95 year-old man tomorrow.
What I am going to do is a shot in the dark, an educated guess at best. Let's hope there is a big surprise in store.
Douglas
|
|
|
Post by marlee on Oct 29, 2015 2:11:39 GMT -5
Hi Doublas!!! These are amazing updates! I can't believe it! I'm so thankful for all your efforts!!! My sister is calling some places in Mexico to see if she can get more information !! I'm feeling hopeful ! Dear Marlee, I am going to give you a progressive report just to keep your spirit up. Yesterday I had a yum cha lunch with some older folks. One an 86 years old returnee from Sydney, who is a Wong from member andrewAU's village. I know him and his other two brothers in Sydney well. The Wong fella has a sister, who at 84 years of age is married to a Lee villager, an old man now at 95 years of age. Though the old man did not join us, but I learned he still has all his marbles. He certainly would not know your g-grandfather even if they were both from the same village. But he may know someone with a likeness to him. There are two villages with the Lee name in my neighbourhood. I have now the two photos on my USB stick, I'll get a printout and get my village brother to take me to the villages. If possible, I'll call on the 95 year-old man tomorrow. What I am going to do is a shot in the dark, an educated guess at best. Let's hope there is a big surprise in store. Douglas
|
|
|
Post by marlee on Oct 29, 2015 2:13:00 GMT -5
Hi Henry!! Thank you so much for this information!! I'm giving all the details to my sister and she will be calling today to as many places as she can!! Thanks again for all the support! Hi Marlee, You may want to try some of these other telephone numbers - I believe anyone of these organizations could probably provide you with up to date information: Several Chinese Mexican community organizations near Mexicali 1 Asociación China de Mexicali Avenida Juárez 120, Zona Centro, Mexicali, B.C. 21100 +52 (686) 552-4651 2 Asociación Chung Shan Avenida Juárez 132, Zona Centro, Mexicali, B.C. 21100 +52 (686) 552-9705 3 First Chinese Baptist Church 702 Encinas Avenue, Calexico, CA 92231 +1 (760) 357-6333 4 Iglesia Bautista Bethel Calle "A" 161, Segunda Sección, Mexicali, B.C. 21100 +52 (686) 554-2166 5 Mexicali Baptist Mission Condominios Monte Albán 408, Calz. de los Presidentes, Zona Centro, Mexicali, B.C. 21100 Henry
|
|
|
Post by marlee on Oct 29, 2015 2:14:37 GMT -5
Thanks for this tip! I think it would be quite interesting to see what he knows about. I have found his email so I will email him ASAP. Thanks!! For historical background and context, the book "Alien Nation: Chinese Migration in the Americas from the Coolie Era through WWII" by Elliott Young has extensive information on the Chinese immigration to Mexico. If you contact that author, he may also have some leads or contacts for you from his research.
|
|
|
Post by philiptancl on Oct 29, 2015 9:22:08 GMT -5
Hi Marlee, From what you have clarified and said so far, would the following a correct representation of your family tree? Philip
|
|
|
Post by marlee on Oct 29, 2015 20:00:45 GMT -5
Hi Philips Here is the representation. I hope that makes sense. Thank you !! Cheers!! Hi Marlee, From what you have clarified and said so far, would the following a correct representation of your family tree? Philip Attachments:
|
|